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Rate cut or no?

scooterbug44 avatar
SoWal Expert
5,487 views
The Fed should cut rates! No, it shouldn't!
Here's why so many people think the Federal Reserve should cut interest rates on Tuesday.
Not everyone agrees that a rate cut is appropriate.

By Charley Blaine

The calls for the Federal Reserve to cut interest rates have morphed from polite talk to mob chanting since Sept. 7, when the Labor Department reported a surprising decline in payroll employment in August.
Now the Fed is widely expected to cut its key rate from 5.25% to 5% or even 4.75%. The fed funds rate -- what banks charge each other for overnight loans -- has been at 5.25% since June 2006. The fed funds rate is what banks and other lenders use to price everything from business loans to credit card rates.
Martin Feldstein, a former chairman of the president's Council of Economic Advisers, believes the Fed should work the rate down to 4% or lower over the next 12 months. But not everyone wants a rate cut. So the argument will rage until the central bank's Federal Open Market Committee, the group that actually sets rates, gathers in Washington, D.C., on Tuesday.

Here's how the debate breaks down.
The case for a rate cut
Supporters of a rate cut give four main reasons:

The global credit system still needs help. A rate cut, the argument goes, would help ensure the credit system has enough cash to keep functioning. The system nearly froze up in August when many lenders balked at buying short-term debt like commercial paper, because lenders didn't trust what was being offered as security on the debt. The credit crunch quickly spread around the world.

Problems in the housing and real-estate industries are spreading into the broader economy. Cutting rates would allow more people to buy homes at prices close to what sellers want. That would shore up lenders' finances and demand for new and existing homes. Housing starts are off about 30% from two years ago, while sales of existing homes are projected to be down about 8.6%. A slipping economy means fewer trips to Home Depot, Lowe's and other hardware stores, fewer furniture and appliance sales, and damage to state and local fees and tax revenues. The Wall Street Journal noted that the city of Sultan, Wash., had to lay off its janitor because building permit fees collapsed.

The broader economy is slowing down. The domestic automobile industry is reeling from the combination of Japanese competition and the automakers' over-reliance on gas-guzzling vehicles for profit. Consumers increasingly are strapped amid higher prices and only limited gains in wages.

Lenders need time to understand how bad their problems are. Wall Street investment houses made billions selling securities backed by pools of mortgages to investors around the world. The big unknown is whether the mortgages backing the pools are any good. Do Wall Street firms need to buy back the securities if the loans go bad?

Why the Fed shouldn't cut rates

Opponents of a cut also give a handful of reasons:

It would bail out the stupids. The credit crunch of 2007 began with increasing defaults of mortgages made to people with little or no credit histories. Critics say that was stupid lending and that those who are responsible should be held accountable.

It would boost inflation. A rate cut by the Fed will come as central banks around the world are raising rates or at least keeping them steady. That trend has cut the value of the U.S. dollar, which has set record lows against the euro. It has also caused sellers of key commodities to boost prices to maintain their purchasing power. It's no fluke that gold jumped over $700 this week and that crude oil traded over $80 a barrel for the first time ever.

The U.S. economy isn't that weak. Yes, housing and real estate are weak, but, critics say, speculation in state likes Florida, Arizona, Nevada and California was totally out of hand. Yes, the automobile business is a mess. But U.S. manufacturing overall is still very strong -- just ask Boeing. The service economy is still quite strong -- McDonald's said its same-store sales in August were up more than 8%.

If anything, the global economy may be too strong. The economies in China, India and elsewhere in Asia are booming, fueling superstrong demand for commodities and finished goods. Cutting rates would be like throwing lighter fuel on an open fire.

Some financial pain is necessary. Just as tech stocks became grotesquely overpriced in the late 1990s, so, too, did residential real estate in the first six years of the New Millennium, thanks to ridiculously cheap money and the growing belief in minimal risk. The excesses, as Bank of England Gov. Mervyn King said this week, need to be cleaned out, and he signaled he has no intention of standing in the way of that process.

Replies

37
SHELLY avatar
SoWal Insider
#27
Goofer, are you punting JOE now?
anything else you like in here. more SUNCOR??

You wouldn't be trying to "buy on Goofer's ideas," would you??:confused:

.
scooterbug44 avatar
SoWal ExpertAuthor
#28
Like Chrysler and Amtrak? If we can spend 300 billion in Iraq why should we not help others at home?

I can think of many ways to spend money improving people's lives (within our borders) and for some reason they DON'T involve rewarding/bailing out people for spending too much on McMansions and overextending themselves flipping real estate. :angry:
Smiling JOe avatar
SoWal Expert
#29
I REALLY want the people who were stupid & greedy to be punished

Isn't that thought of wanting the greedy to be punished along the same lines as greed? Don't you think all of the greedy people are learning their lesson without your strong desire to see their failure? :idontno:
scooterbug44 avatar
SoWal ExpertAuthor
#30
I don't want them to be punished just to be punished, I just want them to have consequences for their actions in the hopes that they will learn something and not do it again.
Capricious avatar
Beach Fanatic
#31
"...All good signs for the economy ahead right??? We can just borrow ourselves out of any problem, cant we??? Okay sarcasm off... I'm getting a bit worried here about the state of our country, its citizens, and the joksters running it..."



As my good budy Rush would say, "Ditto."
Smiling JOe avatar
SoWal Expert
#32
I don't want them to be punished just to be punished, I just want them to have consequences for their actions in the hopes that they will learn something and not do it again.
In my opinion, they are being punished right now, and a 1/2 point drop isn't going to make much difference in their suffering. Even a full point wouldn't change things much for the greedy. I think they really got "learned their lessen" when their interest only one year loans were converted into other loans were they had to come up with additional down payment and start paying principle. That is when the punishment began, and it hasn't improved from their perspective yet. Even if the 1/2 point reduction was passed to them, what are they going to do with what will still be a negative cash flow, which grows larger with each month that passes that they don't sell? Celebrate? I doubt it.
goofer avatar
Beach Fanatic
#33
I don't want them to be punished just to be punished, I just want them to have consequences for their actions in the hopes that they will learn something and not do it again.

People will always figure out ways to game the system, that is the nature of capitalism, HISTORY ALWAYS REPEATS ITSELF. Different players and different circumstances in the future but behavior ( greed and fear ) will be the same. The people that have been or will be flushed now, will be replaced with a new set of scammers and wiseguys in the future.
Bob avatar
SoWal Insider
#34
hedge fund rescue, no?
goofer avatar
Beach Fanatic
#35
hedge fund rescue, no?

I don't think so. More of a bail out of the big brokers and banks.
scooterbug44 avatar
SoWal ExpertAuthor
#36
People will always figure out ways to game the system, that is the nature of capitalism, HISTORY ALWAYS REPEATS ITSELF. Different players and different circumstances in the future but behavior ( greed and fear ) will be the same. The people that have been or will be flushed now, will be replaced with a new set of scammers and wiseguys in the future.

True, I am just too much of an optimist thinking that people would learn a lesson and pass those lessons on to their kids :(. If common sense trumped greed, I'd have a lot less to kvetch about overall.
Capricious avatar
Beach Fanatic
#37
"...HISTORY ALWAYS REPEATS ITSELF..."


True.

Is not Vietnam currently repeating itself?
(possibly because W missed-out on the "Vietnam
experience?")

The oil price situation is repeating itself, except that
in 1973 the average U.S. citizen was driving a humungous
Pontiac or Buick, and in 2007 the average U.S. citizen is
driving a humungous Expediton/Suburban/ 3/4 ton pickup

Anyone remember the red, yellow, & green flags in front of
service stations? (anyone remember service stations?)

Green meant open and had gasoline, yellow meant open for
service (anyone remember "service") but no gasoline,
and red meant closed.

Anyone remember 1979 when you had to buy a minimum number
of gallans of gasoline depending upon how many cylinders
your vehicle had? I drove an SUV back then, when no one outside
of the hard-core 4-wheel-drive/off-road set knew what an SUV
was.

Manual transmission, manual-shift transer case, manual locking
hubs,manual steering (keep your thumbs out of the spokes
when the front axle is engaged).

No AC

Power windows and electric door locks? Are you kidding???

This was a MAN'S vehicle.

Suburban housewives need not apply.




See what happens when I have a beer.
Beach Comber
#38
Capricious -
I remember all of that pretty well and must say that I think your trip down memory land is pretty accurate, except you forgot to add: long employment lines, kids going to school well into June because they had to stay home from school during winter months, people wondering how they would survive the "ice age" that was predicted to arrive within the decade, and many people wondering if there would be enough water for us to drink within 25 years. It is no wonder the drug use skyrocketed in this country as people sought some relief from the horrors of it all (including the war) as the 70's wound to a close. That whole government sponsored drug policy is food for a separate discussion. Who would have thought we would pay what we do for water purification systems and bottled water today? Had I known, I could have been wealthy beyond words right now. If you have another beer and check out Shelly's link on money supply, you may wnat another beer :blush:

Anyway, these next few years will be challenging and it is important that we remember that what we see in the media, regardless of where it comes from is propaganda of some sort or another... that said, I hope and pray that we don't find history repeating itself and I also pray that the history of the fall of the Byzantine Empire doesn't repeat itself anytime soon. Also, I hope that any of the lessons taught by Queen Isabella/Spain will be reviewed by those in power before any decisions about what next to do are carried out. Have a great evening!

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