I just returned from PCB. Almost every realtor I talked to was counting on the Airport to turn the market around. Some thought just breaking ground on it would start the turnaround.
One realtor wrote an article I saw saying PCB would get 8 million NEW visitors a year when the airport is completed.
As someone very familiar with airlines and the current PCB airport I have a few thoughts of my own.
The current gate space and runway length at PCB is ample enough now to handle much larger aircraft. Airlines have flown much larger planes at times into PCB than they currently use and could again at any time. The problem is not one of size of airport, it is lack of demand to fly to PCB that dictates the small aircraft size used in the market. (Same for Ft Walton)
Europeans can fly to PCB now with one stop to change planes and there is little demand to do it. A direct flight from London to PCB would make it easier, but it is not going to greatly increase a demand that is currently pretty small.
If you build it they will come. Worked in Field of Dreams, not so sure about the Panhandle. And I love the Panhandle.
Flyguy
Replies
43
Beach Fanatic
The current gate space and runway length at PCB is ample enough now to handle much larger aircraft. Airlines have flown much larger planes at times into PCB than they currently use and could again at any time. The problem is not one of size of airport, it is lack of demand to fly to PCB that dictates the small aircraft size used in the market. (Same for Ft Walton)
Europeans can fly to PCB now with one stop to change planes and there is little demand to do it. A direct flight from London to PCB would make it easier, but it is not going to greatly increase a demand that is currently pretty small.
If you build it they will come. Worked in Field of Dreams, not so sure about the Panhandle. And I love the Panhandle.
Flyguy
Yeah but, yeah but... ;-)
The current airport doesn't have any low airfare airlines and virtually all flights change over in Atlanta. For the time, trouble and cost to fly here one can just as easily drive here AND have your car.
With the new airport, folks can get here faster and cheaper if a JetBlue or Southwest gets a gate or two. Much faster and cheaper not to mention closer to 30A and Destin. It's not quantity but quality of flights that has everyone excited.
SoWal Insider
I just returned from PCB. Almost every realtor I talked to was counting on the Airport to turn the market around. Some thought just breaking ground on it would start the turnaround.
It's called hitching one's wagon to a star....
Many realtors never really understood the economic dynamics that were in place to start and sustain the RE Boom (and its subsequent drop). It was speculators selling to speculators selling to speculators--with the help of 1% money.
They'll find a few folks out there that may believe the "new airport rhetoric"--there's one born every minute--but not nearly enough to finance a high networth lifestyle. Lucky for them, there's plenty of service jobs available in the area to get them through this summer.
Edited
Beach Fanatic
According to the Daily Fishwrapper, VPS is now agressively going after a $600K grant to help bring Southwest and/or Jet Blue there. So heavy competition for the remaining discounters in the pool since AirTran seems happy to just have Pensacola in the region. Landing fees at VPS are also supposed to be insanely cheap compared to many civilian airports. (Hey, when the AF takes care of runway maitenance for you, you can pass along those cost savings)
And Pensacola's extremely agressive about getting the 'good airlines' to chose there as their Panhandle option even though they're roughly the same size as the current Panama City airport, and totally landlocked. They're getting 1.6 million passengers into a small area ever year, and Panama City's getting something like less than 400K.
No one's just going to give new services to the new PCB airport just because they're new. They need agressive leadership, and then just maybe they'll start breaking thr 500K number.
I'm getting annoyed at how much the new airport is being pushed as everything up to and including a cure for cancer. But no one seems to care about the reality, just about the short term fantasy of 747s filled with German tourists.
And Pensacola's extremely agressive about getting the 'good airlines' to chose there as their Panhandle option even though they're roughly the same size as the current Panama City airport, and totally landlocked. They're getting 1.6 million passengers into a small area ever year, and Panama City's getting something like less than 400K.
No one's just going to give new services to the new PCB airport just because they're new. They need agressive leadership, and then just maybe they'll start breaking thr 500K number.
I'm getting annoyed at how much the new airport is being pushed as everything up to and including a cure for cancer. But no one seems to care about the reality, just about the short term fantasy of 747s filled with German tourists.
Admin
Airport or no airport, development is jsut getting started in the panhandle and it won't slow down until it looks like the peninsula. It's not just the airport that will be bringing millions of people here, it will be roads, schools, hospitals, conference centers, cruise ships, gambling, theme parks . . . the list goes on.
It's a bit shortsighted to talk only of an airport, but it is a large part of building momentum, whether it's justified or not, as perception often becomes reality.
It's a bit shortsighted to talk only of an airport, but it is a large part of building momentum, whether it's justified or not, as perception often becomes reality.
Banned
There will always be those naysayers that think that They know all the answers . Not this time grasshopper. The reason pcb will explode over the next few years is St. JOE wants it to happen. One reason that the airport comes into play is because every thriving community has a large air port to facilitate future growth. The growth of large towns are limited to the the ability for communities good infastructure and a large airport. One thing we all know, and that is people are not leaving the area,but instead they're coming to it. You may say well there is not enough business for the airport we have, I would say there is not enough airport for the businesses we need to come to this area. Somebody above our pay grade understands this and thats why it will come whether you think it will or not. nice name change.
:roll:
:roll:
Beach Fanatic
Just because you build it doesn't mean they will come. (see the first several years of revenue from Bo's Bridge)
SoWal Expert
I know many people from 30A to downtown Panty Maw City who will drive to Tally to catch a non-top plane for travel within the USA. There are so many businesses in today's market which don't require a centralized location, but rather, require an airport close by with non-stop flights throughout the US. Many of those people seem to be the same type people who look to relocate here. I think by having the non-stop flights, many existing locals will be flying out of PCB, rather than driving to Tally. Also, I see the PCB airport as an attraction for the business people who are looking to relocate. The PCB airport is sure to get regular existing and frequent vistors from the South East US, by providing the non-stop flights. As mentioned earlier, with stops in ATL, one may be able to drive here in about the same time as flying, without the hassles of airports, and having to rent a car.
In addition, I will say that without the airport located in Greenville, technically Spartanburg, SC, BMW and other major industries would have never selected to open shop there, regardless of the labor pool and tax incentives which they were given.
That said, current prices here have already adjusted for the airport, just as current prices in Gulf County have already adjusted for St Joe's future infrastructure. That is one of the things which attributed to the excitement and run-up frienzy a couple of years ago.
All of those things which Kurt mentioned earlier to tend to grow exponentially with time. Look at Destin today, compared to five years ago. Look at Seaside today, compared to ten years ago. JOE is the cause for the new airport, but they are not looking at today's usage. They are looking at the need for 10 years down the road. Think ahead in time to when the demand exists for all of the condos on PCB. I recall when Destin didn't have a demand for the condos it had, and people were practically giving them away. We saw that change, and even more were added. Now we are in another down-turn. Growth will continue and eventually, inventory will be taken by end-users, from PCB to Destin. Without being prepared for it, we would be a little crazy when it does get here.
In addition, I will say that without the airport located in Greenville, technically Spartanburg, SC, BMW and other major industries would have never selected to open shop there, regardless of the labor pool and tax incentives which they were given.
That said, current prices here have already adjusted for the airport, just as current prices in Gulf County have already adjusted for St Joe's future infrastructure. That is one of the things which attributed to the excitement and run-up frienzy a couple of years ago.
All of those things which Kurt mentioned earlier to tend to grow exponentially with time. Look at Destin today, compared to five years ago. Look at Seaside today, compared to ten years ago. JOE is the cause for the new airport, but they are not looking at today's usage. They are looking at the need for 10 years down the road. Think ahead in time to when the demand exists for all of the condos on PCB. I recall when Destin didn't have a demand for the condos it had, and people were practically giving them away. We saw that change, and even more were added. Now we are in another down-turn. Growth will continue and eventually, inventory will be taken by end-users, from PCB to Destin. Without being prepared for it, we would be a little crazy when it does get here.
Beach Lover
sooo anyone want to buy a lot in Laird Point? Pretty please..:razz:
Banned
u ant right:blink:
Beach LoverAuthor
Yeah but, yeah but... ;-)
With the new airport, folks can get here faster and cheaper if a JetBlue or Southwest gets a gate or two. Much faster and cheaper not to mention closer to 30A and Destin. It's not quantity but quality of flights that has everyone excited.
Southwest may well decide to serve the new airport if it consolidates traffic throughout the panhandle to one place.
But there is nothing stopping them from serving PCB now, except not enough traffic to make it profitable.
Flyguy
Beach LoverAuthor
Airport or no airport, development is jsut getting started in the panhandle and it won't slow down until it looks like the peninsula. It's not just the airport that will be bringing millions of people here, it will be roads, schools, hospitals, conference centers, cruise ships, gambling, theme parks . . . the list goes on.
It's a bit shortsighted to talk only of an airport, but it is a large part of building momentum, whether it's justified or not, as perception often becomes reality.
I did not say the area would not eventually grow into a new airport. I have no doubt it will. The point I was making is I do not think the airport is going to suddenly turn around the market in PCB.
Flyguy
Edited
SoWal Insider
Southwest may well decide to serve the new airport if it consolidates traffic throughout the panhandle to one place.
But there is nothing stopping them from serving PCB now, except not enough traffic to make it profitable.
Flyguy
...and the fact that it has branded itself a "Lame Duck" airport.
.
Beach LoverAuthor
There will always be those naysayers that think that They know all the answers . Not this time grasshopper. The reason pcb will explode over the next few years is St. JOE wants it to happen.
I simply gave my opinion, I do not claim to have all or even some of the answers.
Flyguy
Beach Lover
I know many people from 30A to downtown Panty Maw City who will drive to Tally to catch a non-top plane for travel within the USA. There are so many businesses in today's market which don't require a centralized location, but rather, require an airport close by with non-stop flights throughout the US. Many of those people seem to be the same type people who look to relocate here. I think by having the non-stop flights, many existing locals will be flying out of PCB, rather than driving to Tally. Also, I see the PCB airport as an attraction for the business people who are looking to relocate. The PCB airport is sure to get regular existing and frequent vistors from the South East US, by providing the non-stop flights. As mentioned earlier, with stops in ATL, one may be able to drive here in about the same time as flying, without the hassles of airports, and having to rent a car.
In addition, I will say that without the airport located in Greenville, technically Spartanburg, SC, BMW and other major industries would have never selected to open shop there, regardless of the labor pool and tax incentives which they were given.
That said, current prices here have already adjusted for the airport, just as current prices in Gulf County have already adjusted for St Joe's future infrastructure. That is one of the things which attributed to the excitement and run-up frienzy a couple of years ago.
All of those things which Kurt mentioned earlier to tend to grow exponentially with time. Look at Destin today, compared to five years ago. Look at Seaside today, compared to ten years ago. JOE is the cause for the new airport, but they are not looking at today's usage. They are looking at the need for 10 years down the road. Think ahead in time to when the demand exists for all of the condos on PCB. I recall when Destin didn't have a demand for the condos it had, and people were practically giving them away. We saw that change, and even more were added. Now we are in another down-turn. Growth will continue and eventually, inventory will be taken by end-users, from PCB to Destin. Without being prepared for it, we would be a little crazy when it does get here.
:clap_1:
Admin
I did not say the area would not eventually grow into a new airport. I have no doubt it will. The point I was making is I do not think the airport is going to suddenly turn around the market in PCB.
Flyguy
And my point was that I agree with your point.
Beach Fanatic
Like Smiling Joe said and as a local in the area I will gladly drive to Tallahassee to avoid nightmare of Atlanta. If new airport helps with this then they can count on me for patronage! I have no idea what this will or will not to RE - not my specialty - however I also agree with Kurt that development and growth will continue regardless of how much people like or dislike this.
Having said that: it will be years and years before Europeans come here in significant numbers - this area has incredible beaches but lacks the culture many europeans want (even when they are on vacation) - therefore they will pick Miami, Dubai, Mexico, etc... way before they pick the FL panhandle.
Having said that: it will be years and years before Europeans come here in significant numbers - this area has incredible beaches but lacks the culture many europeans want (even when they are on vacation) - therefore they will pick Miami, Dubai, Mexico, etc... way before they pick the FL panhandle.
Skunky
Like Smiling Joe said and as a local in the area I will gladly drive to Tallahassee to avoid nightmare of Atlanta. If new airport helps with this then they can count on me for patronage! I have no idea what this will or will not to RE - not my specialty - however I also agree with Kurt that development and growth will continue regardless of how much people like or dislike this.
Having said that: it will be years and years before Europeans come here in significant numbers - this area has incredible beaches but lacks the culture many europeans want (even when they are on vacation) - therefore they will pick Miami, Dubai, Mexico, etc... way before they pick the FL panhandle.
I for one like our culture. Let the speedos flock elsewhere.
Beach LoverAuthor
And my point was that I agree with your point.
Sorry, I reread your post and agree with you as well.
Flyguy
SoWal Insider
This building is exactly what the Orlando Jetport Terminal Building looked like 25 years ago. That was the entire shooting match. Chickpea, unless you count theme parks as culture, your theory may be in trouble. Orlando is overrun by foreign tourists. Until global warming starts frying Northern Europe, those pink Brits and Germans will seek out the cheap date that is Florida.
Edited
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