Deforestation of Walton County

[UpNorth]

Going through the administrative approval process is what any rational land owner would do. It can take years to even get approvals. Then you need funding. The goal for approvals is almost always maximum density.

I just think you guys are getting scared of boogeymen that aren’t really that scary, and may not even occur. It’s easy to hear 1,500 homes approved and run with it. But does anyone really understand how long that takes? Watersound Origins has existed for over a decade and just recently got to 1,000. Forest View bought the 100 acres around Dune Lakes Elementary almost 20 years ago and you have an apartment complex, some self storage, and the Walmart. Topsail/Hewett Rd has a 1000 or so home project that has been working its way through the approval process for 5 years, and if they break ground by 2026 expect to finish in….2042. Watersound Company over the next 5 years is building 200 more homes at Longleaf Park, an Art Park for the public, and a 300 unit multifamily complex. It remains to be seen whether there is even the demand for these, as the number of units seems to far outstrip the population growth. Not everything you hear about or every developers ambition is just going to sprout up out of the ground tomorrow.

 

[Dawn]

Going through the administrative approval process is what any rational land owner would do. It can take years to even get approvals. Then you need funding. The goal for approvals is almost always maximum density.

I just think you guys are getting scared of boogeymen that aren’t really that scary, and may not even occur. It’s easy to hear 1,500 homes approved and run with it. But does anyone really understand how long that takes? Watersound Origins has existed for over a decade and just recently got to 1,000. Forest View bought the 100 acres around Dune Lakes Elementary almost 20 years ago and you have an apartment complex, some self storage, and the Walmart. Topsail/Hewett Rd has a 1000 or so home project that has been working its way through the approval process for 5 years, and if they break ground by 2026 expect to finish in….2042. Watersound Company over the next 5 years is building 200 more homes at Longleaf Park, an Art Park for the public, and a 300 unit multifamily complex. It remains to be seen whether there is even the demand for these, as the number of units seems to far outstrip the population growth. Not everything you hear about or every developers ambition is just going to sprout up out of the ground tomorrow.

Sorry if this offends but your mentality is a big part of the problem. The speed of change has nothing to do with my point. It is the nature of it.

Another red flag is whenever someone mentions conservation or careful planning is the typical response of "but look at all the state forest and parks". It is because people cared about the land and quality of life in the past that we have them and we should strive to continue the legacy gifted to us, not use it as an excuse to do whatever we want on private and county owned property.

"Maximum Density" and "Highest and Best Value" are developers', builders', realtors', investors' terms which are at odds with sensible regulations and planning, and often are contradictory, in that restraint and care create more value which is shown time and time again.

Alas, greed and money pressures cause shortsightedness and mistakes. It's the system we find ourselves in I understand. It takes strength to go against the flow but is worth the effort.

 

[UpNorth]

I don’t entirely disagree with some of that, but to me, again, as someone who’s newer and now residing rather than visiting, the area absolutely lacks critical infrastructure. The biggest problems I see, is that the economic engine is conditioned to rely on tourism and real estate related transactions or projects.

It is setup, to serve wealthy tourists, not residents. Everything south of 98 fits that bill. And that’s fine and all, many places have their niche and need to lean on their strengths to pay the bills. But it’s only with more development that the residential aspects get addressed. The schools are packed, the roads a disaster. Everything is unnecessarily expensive.

Development solves a lot of this. It’s great that pizzas cost $40 because Inlet Beach refuses to do much “big corporate” stuff. It’s great having all the local “cafes” that want $7 for a black coffee. But this isn’t really in the best interests of people who aren’t visiting for a week in June. Yet the locals rage because ONE McDonalds was given the green light over on the west side of 98. If you want more teachers you need normal people homes to get built above 98. Which means DR Horton boxes.

If the goal is to be completely off the grid amongst nature there’s plenty of that up 331. There’s beachfront options with that lifestyle in Port St Joe which will not be developed in either of our lifetimes. But South Walton is a unique place and it seems ready to become a real, year round residential area. What’s holding it back it seems is the 2nd and 3rd home folks don’t care, and too many locals want to fight everything because they feel it’s overdeveloped. But bring in anyone else from the state of Florida and the last word you’ll hear used to describe this area is “overdeveloped”. Sometimes there’s growing pains during transitions, but if it’s done right, it’s worth it in the long run. Locals need to relax, 98 is never going to be I4.

 

[Dawn]

I don’t entirely disagree with some of that, but to me, again, as someone who’s newer and now residing rather than visiting, the area absolutely lacks critical infrastructure. The biggest problems I see, is that the economic engine is conditioned to rely on tourism and real estate related transactions or projects.

By problem I assume you mean a lot of service jobs that don't pay enough to make a living. But there are a lot of people making BIG money and a lot of them are recent residents.



It is setup, to serve wealthy tourists, not residents. Everything south of 98 fits that bill. And that’s fine and all, many places have their niche and need to lean on their strengths to pay the bills. But it’s only with more development that the residential aspects get addressed. The schools are packed, the roads a disaster. Everything is unnecessarily expensive.

Development solves a lot of this. It’s great that pizzas cost $40 because Inlet Beach refuses to do much “big corporate” stuff. It’s great having all the local “cafes” that want $7 for a black coffee. But this isn’t really in the best interests of people who aren’t visiting for a week in June. Yet the locals rage because ONE McDonalds was given the green light over on the west side of 98. If you want more teachers you need normal people homes to get built above 98. Which means DR Horton boxes.

Pretzel logic. We're overdeveloped and infrastructure is lacking so let's develop more.

Locals raging about McDonald's? I am not on social media so can't speak to that, but fast food has gotten very expensive and sux. Inlet Beach is wide open - but Seaside, Alys etc. does prefer local business owners and no chains. Do we need more high price tourist traps though? Chain or not?



If the goal is to be completely off the grid amongst nature there’s plenty of that up 331. There’s beachfront options with that lifestyle in Port St Joe which will not be developed in either of our lifetimes.

Areas near the beach are building like crazy and even sleepy Port St. Joe is growing. Again your timeline may be off. Just because there is available beachfront doesn't mean they don't need to protect themselves also.




But South Walton is a unique place and it seems ready to become a real, year round residential area. What’s holding it back it seems is the 2nd and 3rd home folks don’t care, and too many locals want to fight everything because they feel it’s overdeveloped. But bring in anyone else from the state of Florida and the last word you’ll hear used to describe this area is “overdeveloped”. Sometimes there’s growing pains during transitions, but if it’s done right, it’s worth it in the long run. Locals need to relax, 98 is never going to be I4.

It's already year round - witness threads in the real estate forum about thousands of apartments and homes and prices going up and up - even Horton is too expensive in Owl's Head - teachers and the like can't afford them.

All of 98 will be 6, then 8 lanes before you know it. Because of runaway development. When you can't even get to the beach or onto 30A because traffic is bumper to bumper, you'll lament the good old days, and maybe wonder why you wanted more more more.

 

[UpNorth]

Guess we can just agree to disagree.

The state, and even more so the county are unquestionably growing. This will not stop no matter how badly people want it to. HWY 98 is not really functional as a 2 lane highway anymore. This is going to get worse, not better, regardless of future development. Watersound Parkway and 395 functioning as pretty much the only path from 30A to 98, does not work and will only get worse. And even there, if it wasn’t for a developer, using their own land, you wouldn’t have the Parkway either.

The school situation needs to be addressed. So far, the only people whom have accelerated any material improvements as far as the schools go, are….drumroll, developers.

People wince at another Walmart being built, but the reason Publix can charge $7 for a box of cereal and $6 for a bottle of salad dressing is because they know people won’t drive 30 minutes each way east or west to the Walmart where those items are $2.99 and $2.49.

On beach traffic, it is what it is. Apparently customary use is going to kill tourism so if that overreaction comes to fruition then traffic should ease.

 

[James Bentwood]

Guess we can just agree to disagree.

The state, and even more so the county are unquestionably growing. This will not stop no matter how badly people want it to. HWY 98 is not really functional as a 2 lane highway anymore. This is going to get worse, not better, regardless of future development. Watersound Parkway and 395 functioning as pretty much the only path from 30A to 98, does not work and will only get worse. And even there, if it wasn’t for a developer, using their own land, you wouldn’t have the Parkway either.

The school situation needs to be addressed. So far, the only people whom have accelerated any material improvements as far as the schools go, are….drumroll, developers.

People wince at another Walmart being built, but the reason Publix can charge $7 for a box of cereal and $6 for a bottle of salad dressing is because they know people won’t drive 30 minutes each way east or west to the Walmart where those items are $2.99 and $2.49.

On beach traffic, it is what it is. Apparently customary use is going to kill tourism so if that overreaction comes to fruition then traffic should ease.

Almost every sentence is wrong. Do you even live here?

98 is not 2 lanes. It is 4 lanes between west end of Panama City Beach and the newly added lanes at the west end of 30A.

Hwy 395 and Watersound parkway the only paths? Ever been on 283, 83 or 393? Plus 30A intersects with 98 twice.

Customary use doesn't harm tourism. The opposite.

No one said to stop development. Just developing with common sense instead of selling out totally like almost every other place in Florida that has been ruined over the last 100 years. Or at least develop without scraping the land. Old growth trees were almost completely removed from our landscape in SoWal 100 years ago. And just when we're starting to recover, builders are allowed to remove everything and plant non native plants and palm trees. It's idiotic.

 

[Poppaj]

All of this back and forth is moot as long as the voters, especially in this region, keep electing the party that voted to defund the EPA by 40%, wants to “drill baby drill” and would like nothing more than to rid the nation of any regulations that interfere with corporate profits.

 

[UpNorth]

Almost every sentence is wrong. Do you even live here?

98 is not 2 lanes. It is 4 lanes between west end of Panama City Beach and the newly added lanes at the west end of 30A.

Hwy 395 and Watersound parkway the only paths? Ever been on 283, 83 or 393? Plus 30A intersects with 98 twice.

Customary use doesn't harm tourism. The opposite.

No one said to stop development. Just developing with common sense instead of selling out totally like almost every other place in Florida that has been ruined over the last 100 years. Or at least develop without scraping the land. Old growth trees were almost completely removed from our landscape in SoWal 100 years ago. And just when we're starting to recover, builders are allowed to remove everything and plant non native plants and palm trees. It's idiotic.

Florida has been ruined over the past 100 years? It’s pretty easily the most, or at worst, second most popular state as far as migration goes. This is just a made up statement.

98 runs thru the entire Panhandle. As the area evolves it needs to as well. It’s the only freakin road. Of course it’s going to be expanded over time.
And 30A traffic is no biggie cuz from Seaside School you have a couple options on how to spend 20-30 minutes getting to 98. Got it. Guess we missed what a nightmare everything was when Deer Lake Bridge was closed.

On customary use I wasn’t stating anything other than what many have been declaring in the threads about customary use. Apparently it’s going to ruin South Walton. Oh the drama. Everything is the end of the world.

This is by far the least developed region in the state. It’s been growing as more people decide this is where they want to be.

Despite this, the County has done more than most in efforts to preserve much of its beauty, and the largest landowner has pledged to to put billions of dollars worth of land into conservation. And yet all you hear is locals screaming bloody murder because they think coming out of the Stone Age and getting with the times is the end of the world. They don’t like other people’s homes, they’re bitter about the traffic. They mock the folks on 30A. They hate the big greedy corporations for no legitimate reason. This is such an amazing place I don’t get the point in wasting so much energy getting all strung out about all these things. You people are spoiled, and aught to see what goes on in 99% of cities/towns/regions in the country.

 

[bob1]

You people

Now you done it.

Where up north you come from? Somewhere everyone is smarter and everything is done better right?

 

[UpNorth]

Now you done it.

Where up north you come from? Somewhere everyone is smarter and everything is done better right?

No, not at all.

In fact, a place where getting anything done takes forever. Where bureaucrats need to grandstand through a dozen meetings for a road to be paved. Where it takes a decade to approve a 40 home planned community. Where every resident feels the world needs their input on what other people should be doing with their private property. Where the people whom scream the loudest always seem to get their way.

Then you come here, and whether taking a simple drive, or if too lazy, a Google Satellite shot, go from call it 331, up til I10, then over to ECP, call it HWY 79, drive all that, bottom to top, over, back down, take 98….people are really going to complain about overdevelopment?

You have trails and parks and then these gorgeously crafted mini towns, the beaches and the bay, fishing, camping, youth sports…none of this stuff is made worse or taken away from you because more people want to live here or because over the next 15 years there’s a proposed 900 home project on a 2000 acre piece of land. That’s surrounded by thousands of untouched acres. With literally not one home built on either side of the Intracoastal Waterway.