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Thread: The biggest u.s.welfare states


  1. #1
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    This was a surprising list. Tennessee is the only southern state, and Illinois doesn't make the list. What happened to all those New Englanders who were so darned self-sufficient?


    1. California
    2. Maine
    3. Tennessee
    4. Massachusetts
    5. Vermont
    6. District of Columbia
    7. New York
    8. Minnesota
    9. Washington
    10. (tie) New Mexico
    10. (tie) Indiana
    12. Rhode Island
    13. Michigan
    14. Pennsylvania
    15. Oregon

    It looks, however, like this is only TANF - I don't know that it shows all welfare programs.

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    the only state that surprised me was TN and im interested to see what i come up with as to why. as a new england native, im not surprised by the list of north eastern states. Mass is a complete mess. you can literally see the difference just from crossing the Mass/NH line on hwy 93. NH was self sufficient and still is for the most part, but Mass. migration has greatly hurt that state and i know this for a certainty. people are moving out of tax Mass, but bringing the same thought process they had in Mass with them. the NH/Mass line is a great example of this versus inner NH. big government states are the biggest failures and there is no way to deny it anylonger. the quicker they and those on the left understand that, the quicker we can turn it around. Cali and Mass should be a huge lesson to us all.... when politics are put aside and clear thinking becomes a reality once again, we can see things for what they, or not.

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  5. #4
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    Yep Massachusetts sure is a hellish nightmare.

    Massachusetts:
    2010 Budget $43,421,957,000.00 Link
    Per person spending - $6682.39

    Florida:
    2010 Budget $66,518,023,862 Link
    Per person spending - $3629.24

    Just to be fair and balanced:

    Retirement Living - Taxes by State: Kansas - New Mexico

    FLORIDA
    Sales Taxes
    State Sales Tax: 6% (food, prescription and non-
    prescription drugs exempt). There are additional county sales taxes which could make the combined rate as high as 9.5%.
    Gasoline Tax: 34.5 cents/gallon
    Diesel Fuel Tax: * 29.8 cents/gallon
    (Local taxes for gasoline vary from 5.5 cents to 17 cents, plus there is a 2.07% gasoline pollution tax.)
    Cigarette Tax: 33.9 cents/pack of 20 ($1.00 surcharge added on each pack in 2010)

    Personal Income Taxes
    No state income tax
    Retirement Income: Not taxed. Starting in 2007, individuals, married couples, personal representatives of estates, and businesses are no longer required to file an annual intangible personal property tax return reporting their stocks, bonds, mutual funds, money market funds, shares of business trusts, and unsecured notes. For details, click here.

    Property Taxes
    All property is taxable at 100% of its just valuation. In certain counties and cities homeowners 65 and over can receive a homestead exemption from property tax of $25,000 if their household income, as defined by the federal tax code, is at or below $27,539 (single) or $30,917 (couples) per year (2008 figures). The income limitation is adjusted each year based on the cost of living index. In many instances the definition of household income excludes Social Security. Permanent residents may also be entitled to a homestead exemption regardless of age. Residents 65 and older are entitled to both exemptions ($50,000). The senior citizen's homestead exemption applies only to tax millage levied by the county or city, and does not apply to millage of school districts or other taxing authorities. The homestead exemption for all residents applies to all property taxes, not just city and county taxes. Annual increases in the assessment of homestead property are limited to 3% of the prior year's assessed value, or if lower, the percentage change in the Consumer Price Index for the prior, as long as there was no change in ownership. A 2006 law provides a property tax discount on homestead property owned by eligible veterans. To be eligible, a veteran must have an honorable discharge from military service, be at least 65 years old, be partially disabled with a permanent service connected disability all or a portion of which must be combat-related, and must have been a Florida resident at the time of entering military service. This discount is in addition to any other exemptions veterans now receive.

    A 2007 law allows local governments to give those age 65 and above - with low incomes - an increased homestead exemption. Cities and counties have the option of doubling an existing homestead exemption on primary owner-occupied homes from $25,000 to $50,000. To qualify, taxpayers must have an annual income of $20,000 or less.
    For more details on property taxes, click here, then find the link for the county property appraiser for the county in question. For more information on Florida property tax exemptions, click here.

    Inheritance and Estate Taxes
    There is no inheritance tax and only a limited estate tax.



    MASSACHUSETTS
    Sales Taxes
    State Sales Tax:
    6.25% (food; prescription drugs; fuel costs; gas, oil, electricity; clothing costing up to $175, are exempt). For a complete list, click here.
    Gasoline Tax: 23.5 cents/gallon

    Diesel Fuel Tax: 23.5 cents/gallon
    Cigarette Tax: $2.51/pack of 20

    Personal Income Taxes
    Tax Rate Range:Flat rate of 5.3% of federal adjusted gross income
    Personal Exemptions: Single - $4,400; Married - $8,800;
    Dependents - $1,000
    Standard Deduction: None
    Medical/Dental Deduction: Federal amount
    Federal Income Tax Deduction: None
    Retirement Income Taxes: Social Security, civil service, state/local government pensions are exempt. Pension income from other state or local governments that do not tax pension income from Massachusetts public employees is exempt from Massachusetts taxable income.
    Retired Military Pay: Not taxed. Military Disability Retired Pay: Retirees who entered the military before Sept. 24, 1975, and members receiving disability retirements based on combat injuries or who could receive disability payments from the VA are covered by laws giving disability broad exemption from federal income tax. Most military retired pay based on service-related disabilities also is free from federal income tax, but there is no guarantee of total protection.
    VA Disability Dependency and Indemnity Compensation:VA benefits are not taxable because they generally are for disabilities and are not subject to federal or state taxes.
    Military SBP/SSBP/RCSBP/RSFPP: Generally subject to state taxes for those states with income tax. Check with state department of revenue office.

    Property Taxes
    Massachusetts does not provide for a general homestead exemption but does have a Homestead Act. The Homestead Act permits a homeowner who occupies a house as his/her principal residence to shield up to $500,000 in equity in that house from creditors. By simply filing a Declaration of Homestead with the appropriate Registry of Deeds, a homeowner may be able to protect his/her residence from the claim of a future creditor. The Homestead Act permits only one spouse to file for the equity protection if each has an ownership interest in the home. The protection offered to the disabled and the elderly is even more comprehensive because it allows a husband and wife who own their own home to each file for the $500,000 equity protection. Click for details.

    Massachusetts also has a circuit breaker program that offers a real estate tax credit for persons age 65 and older. Certain taxpayers may be eligible to claim a refundable credit on their state income taxes for the real estate taxes paid during the tax year on the residential property they own or rent in Massachusetts that is used as their principal residence. If the credit due the taxpayer exceeds the amount of the total income tax payable for the year by the taxpayer, the excess amount of the credit will be refunded to the taxpayer without interest. For tax year 2008, the maximum credit allowed for both renters and homeowners is $930. To be eligible for the credit for the 2008 tax year; the taxpayer or spouse, if married filing jointly, must be 65 years of age or older at the close of the 2008 tax year; the taxpayer must own or rent residential property in Massachusetts and occupy the property as his or her principal residence; the taxpayer's "total income" cannot exceed $49,000 for a single filer who is not the head of a household, $62,000 for a head of house hold, or $74,000 for taxpayers filing jointly; and for homeowners, the assessed valuation as of January 1, 2008, before residential exemptions but after abatements, of the homeowner's personal residence cannot exceed $793,000. Click for details.
    Inheritance and Estate Taxes
    There is no inheritance tax and a limited estate tax on estates valued at $1,000,000 or more.

  6. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by SWGB View Post
    Yep Massachusetts sure is a hellish nightmare.

    Massachusetts:
    2010 Budget $43,421,957,000.00 Link
    Per person spending - $6682.39

    Florida:
    2010 Budget $66,518,023,862 Link
    Per person spending - $3629.24

    Just to be fair and balanced:

    Retirement Living - Taxes by State: Kansas - New Mexico

    FLORIDA
    Sales Taxes
    State Sales Tax: 6% (food, prescription and non-
    prescription drugs exempt). There are additional county sales taxes which could make the combined rate as high as 9.5%.
    Gasoline Tax: 34.5 cents/gallon
    Diesel Fuel Tax: * 29.8 cents/gallon
    (Local taxes for gasoline vary from 5.5 cents to 17 cents, plus there is a 2.07% gasoline pollution tax.)
    Cigarette Tax: 33.9 cents/pack of 20 ($1.00 surcharge added on each pack in 2010)

    Personal Income Taxes
    No state income tax
    Retirement Income: Not taxed. Starting in 2007, individuals, married couples, personal representatives of estates, and businesses are no longer required to file an annual intangible personal property tax return reporting their stocks, bonds, mutual funds, money market funds, shares of business trusts, and unsecured notes. For details, click here.

    Property Taxes
    All property is taxable at 100% of its just valuation. In certain counties and cities homeowners 65 and over can receive a homestead exemption from property tax of $25,000 if their household income, as defined by the federal tax code, is at or below $27,539 (single) or $30,917 (couples) per year (2008 figures). The income limitation is adjusted each year based on the cost of living index. In many instances the definition of household income excludes Social Security. Permanent residents may also be entitled to a homestead exemption regardless of age. Residents 65 and older are entitled to both exemptions ($50,000). The senior citizen's homestead exemption applies only to tax millage levied by the county or city, and does not apply to millage of school districts or other taxing authorities. The homestead exemption for all residents applies to all property taxes, not just city and county taxes. Annual increases in the assessment of homestead property are limited to 3% of the prior year's assessed value, or if lower, the percentage change in the Consumer Price Index for the prior, as long as there was no change in ownership. A 2006 law provides a property tax discount on homestead property owned by eligible veterans. To be eligible, a veteran must have an honorable discharge from military service, be at least 65 years old, be partially disabled with a permanent service connected disability all or a portion of which must be combat-related, and must have been a Florida resident at the time of entering military service. This discount is in addition to any other exemptions veterans now receive.

    A 2007 law allows local governments to give those age 65 and above - with low incomes - an increased homestead exemption. Cities and counties have the option of doubling an existing homestead exemption on primary owner-occupied homes from $25,000 to $50,000. To qualify, taxpayers must have an annual income of $20,000 or less.
    For more details on property taxes, click here, then find the link for the county property appraiser for the county in question. For more information on Florida property tax exemptions, click here.

    Inheritance and Estate Taxes
    There is no inheritance tax and only a limited estate tax.



    MASSACHUSETTS
    Sales Taxes
    State Sales Tax:
    6.25% (food; prescription drugs; fuel costs; gas, oil, electricity; clothing costing up to $175, are exempt). For a complete list, click here.
    Gasoline Tax: 23.5 cents/gallon

    Diesel Fuel Tax: 23.5 cents/gallon
    Cigarette Tax: $2.51/pack of 20

    Personal Income Taxes
    Tax Rate Range:Flat rate of 5.3% of federal adjusted gross income
    Personal Exemptions: Single - $4,400; Married - $8,800;
    Dependents - $1,000
    Standard Deduction: None
    Medical/Dental Deduction: Federal amount
    Federal Income Tax Deduction: None
    Retirement Income Taxes: Social Security, civil service, state/local government pensions are exempt. Pension income from other state or local governments that do not tax pension income from Massachusetts public employees is exempt from Massachusetts taxable income.
    Retired Military Pay: Not taxed. Military Disability Retired Pay: Retirees who entered the military before Sept. 24, 1975, and members receiving disability retirements based on combat injuries or who could receive disability payments from the VA are covered by laws giving disability broad exemption from federal income tax. Most military retired pay based on service-related disabilities also is free from federal income tax, but there is no guarantee of total protection.
    VA Disability Dependency and Indemnity Compensation:VA benefits are not taxable because they generally are for disabilities and are not subject to federal or state taxes.
    Military SBP/SSBP/RCSBP/RSFPP: Generally subject to state taxes for those states with income tax. Check with state department of revenue office.

    Property Taxes
    Massachusetts does not provide for a general homestead exemption but does have a Homestead Act. The Homestead Act permits a homeowner who occupies a house as his/her principal residence to shield up to $500,000 in equity in that house from creditors. By simply filing a Declaration of Homestead with the appropriate Registry of Deeds, a homeowner may be able to protect his/her residence from the claim of a future creditor. The Homestead Act permits only one spouse to file for the equity protection if each has an ownership interest in the home. The protection offered to the disabled and the elderly is even more comprehensive because it allows a husband and wife who own their own home to each file for the $500,000 equity protection. Click for details.

    Massachusetts also has a circuit breaker program that offers a real estate tax credit for persons age 65 and older. Certain taxpayers may be eligible to claim a refundable credit on their state income taxes for the real estate taxes paid during the tax year on the residential property they own or rent in Massachusetts that is used as their principal residence. If the credit due the taxpayer exceeds the amount of the total income tax payable for the year by the taxpayer, the excess amount of the credit will be refunded to the taxpayer without interest. For tax year 2008, the maximum credit allowed for both renters and homeowners is $930. To be eligible for the credit for the 2008 tax year; the taxpayer or spouse, if married filing jointly, must be 65 years of age or older at the close of the 2008 tax year; the taxpayer must own or rent residential property in Massachusetts and occupy the property as his or her principal residence; the taxpayer's "total income" cannot exceed $49,000 for a single filer who is not the head of a household, $62,000 for a head of house hold, or $74,000 for taxpayers filing jointly; and for homeowners, the assessed valuation as of January 1, 2008, before residential exemptions but after abatements, of the homeowner's personal residence cannot exceed $793,000. Click for details.
    Inheritance and Estate Taxes
    There is no inheritance tax and a limited estate tax on estates valued at $1,000,000 or more.

    thanks for posting that. im not tech savvy enough to be honest. itll give people a chance to see factual info.

    good stuff, but alot is left out of this. for example the burden on private sector biz is just enormous. the businesss leaving and heading to NH are almost not believable. the roads in mass look like third country roads compared to either of its neighbors. and than theres the "big dig". and the list goes on and on. the state simply cant stay on budget while increasing its expenditures yearly. romney changed alot of that, but his replacement has turned it all back and spent even more. i remember when Nashua NH, Salem and several other border towns were only NH natives...no longer. Something to be said about the fact that most are former Mass residents.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kkddbb View Post
    thanks for posting that. im not tech savvy enough to be honest. itll give people a chance to see factual info.

    good stuff, but alot is left out of this. for example the burden on private sector biz is just enormous. the businesss leaving and heading to NH are almost not believable. the roads in mass look like third country roads compared to either of its neighbors. and than theres the "big dig". and the list goes on and on. the state simply cant stay on budget while increasing its expenditures yearly. romney changed alot of that, but his replacement has turned it all back and spent even more. i remember when Nashua NH, Salem and several other border towns were only NH natives...no longer. Something to be said about the fact that most are former Mass residents.
    Funny how a politician who says no can't seem to stay in office.

    I really don't think the spending in this country is specific to one party or another and to be perfectly honest most politicians are scape goats. We are a representational government and if you look at the big picture the majority really likes to spend. This is then reflected by our representatives.

    If this country really wanted to change it's ways then they'd stop electing the representatives they vote for time after time.

    No more pork seems to be a great buzz term to get elected, but then try and explain to your constituents that they can't have that new highway, airport, library, tax incentive, etc. and stay in office.

  8. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by SWGB View Post
    Funny how a politician who says no can't seem to stay in office.

    I really don't think the spending in this country is specific to one party or another and to be perfectly honest most politicians are scape goats. We are a representational government and if you look at the big picture the majority really likes to spend. This is then reflected by our representatives.

    If this country really wanted to change it's ways then they'd stop electing the representatives they vote for time after time.

    No more pork seems to be a great buzz term to get elected, but then try and explain to your constituents that they can't have that new highway, airport, library, tax incentive, etc. and stay in office.

    i agree completely that both parties are guilty of overspending. however, there is only one party trying to put a stop to it while the other turns its nose and continues to spend. its either a gross misunderstanding on how an economy works or its pure special interest. both are not doing the work of the people.

    term limits are more and more of something i support. partisanship is running rampant in this country. the mslsd zombies will always and only vote democratic because all they hear is how evil the gop is and that they are to blame for everything bad in the world. its tough to change when that kind of stuff is going on.

    and pork doesnt mean stop building roads. thats what the government is supposed to do. what they are not supposed to do is build extravagant gov facilities while roads are crumbling, fund special interest private sector biz, increase entitlement programs etc etc etc. it seams our elected officials have forgotten what the true responsibility of gov is supposed to be. instead many are interested on making a good name for themselves in the eyes of a specific bunch and/or trying to be the hero with a bag of money.

    one things for sure, that wont be changing in the next 3.5 years.....

  9. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blair View Post
    Tennessee?????

    1. Memphis
    2. Rural poverty

    only been to the mountainous areas of TN. but, ive heard my fair share of where Memphis is today. you know better than i on this one. i was still very surprised they were on that list though. you normally dont see a southern state on such a list......they simply get it

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    Quote Originally Posted by kkddbb View Post
    i agree completely that both parties are guilty of overspending. however, there is only one party trying to put a stop to it while the other turns its nose and continues to spend. its either a gross misunderstanding on how an economy works or its pure special interest. both are not doing the work of the people.

    term limits are more and more of something i support. partisanship is running rampant in this country. the mslsd zombies will always and only vote democratic because all they hear is how evil the gop is and that they are to blame for everything bad in the world. its tough to change when that kind of stuff is going on.

    and pork doesnt mean stop building roads. thats what the government is supposed to do. what they are not supposed to do is build extravagant gov facilities while roads are crumbling, fund special interest private sector biz, increase entitlement programs etc etc etc. it seams our elected officials have forgotten what the true responsibility of gov is supposed to be. instead many are interested on making a good name for themselves in the eyes of a specific bunch and/or trying to be the hero with a bag of money.

    one things for sure, that wont be changing in the next 3.5 years.....
    See I'm trying to keep this non-partisan, but you've just got to get your digs in there. Here's a leaf now turn it over.

    Whoever is in the majority will always be viewed as the spend thrifts they usually are when in power. Generally those that support the majority in power will always say that the spending is necessary and defend it no matter what. Those polar opposites are best illustrated from 2000 to the present.

    I fully support term limits as well, if it's good enough for Presidents then it's good enough for everyone else. Again though the policy makers who would make that change are generally the ones we want to be limited, would you take vote to limit your own job? I would support a candidate democrat/republican/independent/libertarian/socialist/communist if their one priority was to enact term limits and actually do it. My only fear of term limits is that it also forces out the good, bash if you want, but there are good politicians although they are very few and far between.

    As to crumbling infrastructure, we do have it all wrong. Our bridges are falling down and killing US citizens, but for some reason we went into another country, destroyed it's infrastructure, and are now trying to rebuild it even though the populace is still so pissed they are blowing it up.

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    This list surprises me as there used to be more Southern states, which were considered poorest states in the nation based upon high welfare recipient percentages. The list tells me there's been more of a migration than anything.
    Helping others is a gift.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SWGB View Post
    See I'm trying to keep this non-partisan, but you've just got to get your digs in there. Here's a leaf now turn it over.

    Whoever is in the majority will always be viewed as the spend thrifts they usually are when in power. Generally those that support the majority in power will always say that the spending is necessary and defend it no matter what. Those polar opposites are best illustrated from 2000 to the present.

    I fully support term limits as well, if it's good enough for Presidents then it's good enough for everyone else. Again though the policy makers who would make that change are generally the ones we want to be limited, would you take vote to limit your own job? I would support a candidate democrat/republican/independent/libertarian/socialist/communist if their one priority was to enact term limits and actually do it. My only fear of term limits is that it also forces out the good, bash if you want, but there are good politicians although they are very few and far between.

    As to crumbling infrastructure, we do have it all wrong. Our bridges are falling down and killing US citizens, but for some reason we went into another country, destroyed it's infrastructure, and are now trying to rebuild it even though the populace is still so pissed they are blowing it up.

    its tough not to be partisan when it comes to spending. its only one party that always and will always spend money we dont have even when a state ie CA is on the brink of bankrupcy. now that some states are facing this realism, its the gop that wants to cut back, not the dems. i wish it wasnt that way, but it is what it is im afraid. bush spent like a drunken sailor and he'll now have to live with the legacy. the gop shouldnt have let him when they were the majority, but they didnt. once the dems took control of the house and senate, the check book was wide open.

    agreed, there are some great political leaders that deserve to be in office long term. i guess its just one of those things that we cant fix. like usual, its the bad apples that ruin it for all.

    good discussion. i enjoyed it. happy hour!!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lynnie View Post
    This list surprises me as there used to be more Southern states, which were considered poorest states in the nation based upon high welfare recipient percentages. The list tells me there's been more of a migration than anything.

    when nissan and toyata move into a small town employment rises. the blue states are losing these kind of companies for a reason, TAXES and NO UNIONS. not sure if i agree with migration as a major factory, but could be a part of it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kkddbb View Post
    its tough not to be partisan when it comes to spending. its only one party that always and will always spend money we dont have even when a state ie CA is on the brink of bankrupcy. now that some states are facing this realism, its the gop that wants to cut back, not the dems. i wish it wasnt that way, but it is what it is im afraid. bush spent like a drunken sailor and he'll now have to live with the legacy. the gop shouldnt have let him when they were the majority, but they didnt. once the dems took control of the house and senate, the check book was wide open.

    agreed, there are some great political leaders that deserve to be in office long term. i guess its just one of those things that we cant fix. like usual, its the bad apples that ruin it for all.

    good discussion. i enjoyed it. happy hour!!!!
    Okay since closing the congressional check book is like getting Paris Hilton to close hers. Let me ask you this:

    Economically is it better for the money to go to another country or stay here in ours?

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