sunspotbaby

Oregon Apartment Complex Bans Flying the American Flag - Local News | News Articles | National News | US News - FOXNews.com

An Oregon apartment complex is banning its residents from flying American flags, not only from their dwellings but also their vehicles, KATU in Portland reported.

Residents' outrage started when Jim Clausen, whose son is in the military and on his way back to Iraq, was told he couldn't fly an American flag from the back of his motorcycle.

If he didn't take the flag down, he was told he'd face eviction, the station reported.

"It floored me," Clausen told the station. "I can't believe she was saying what she was saying. It [the flag] stands for the people that can no longer stand - who died in wars. That's why I fly the flag."

Sharron White, a long-time resident, was told by management to take down the flag she's flown on her car for eight years because "someone might get offended."

"I just said to her, 'They'll just have to get over it,'" White told the station.

The ban also applies to flag stickers on cars, as well as sports flags.

KATU attempted to contact management at the apartment complex, but no one returned their calls.

Click here to read more on this story from KATU.

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Don't confuse having less with being less, having more with being more, or what you have with who you are. Noah benShea

AlphaCrab

No. What is "serious" is how Fox "Noise" has now quickly becomes Sowal "Noise". I am inclined to believe Fox Noise is now becoming the mouth piece of Sowal.Com. ..and part of the vast right wing conspiracy here in the Panhandle!

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Abrupt and needed "change" is hard for anyone to deal with. We have to deal with new paradigms in a new world, but I think things are gradually getting better!

sunspotbaby

Seriously? conspiracy? No one is forcing you to participate. You have free will, no?

__________________
Don't confuse having less with being less, having more with being more, or what you have with who you are. Noah benShea

AlphaCrab

Actually the "conspiracy" part was just for chuckles...

Seriously though, it just seems that Fox Noise likes to get certain people all up in arms over absolutely nothing, you know like Merry Christmas being replaced with Happy Holidays by the left wing media. "Fox to base, Fox to base, come in please."

__________________
Abrupt and needed "change" is hard for anyone to deal with. We have to deal with new paradigms in a new world, but I think things are gradually getting better!

sunspotbaby

You ought to be "up in arms" when some jackass says you can't fly the American Flag in ....AMERICA.

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Don't confuse having less with being less, having more with being more, or what you have with who you are. Noah benShea

Lynnie

Yes, My Daddy would be all over this. And, others are reporting the same story. Oh well, Fox was first and so~~~~~~~

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Who is Lynnie?? ~~~~~~~Signed, All Y'all

kathydwells

Fortunately the ban has been lifted!

Flag ban lifted at apartment complex after huge outcry | KATU.com - News, Weather and Sports - Portland, Oregon | Local & Regional

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~He can who thinks he can, and he can't who thinks he can't. This is and inexorable, indisputable law.~ Pablo Picasso.

poppy

The last line from the article reads - - -

"We're told the ban includes sports flags and even flag stickers on cars."

So it seems they ban all flags of all types, it isn't a ban on the American flag so put your weapons away and calm down.

__________________
"We must recognize the fact that adequate food is only the first requisite for life. For a decent and humane life we must also provide an opportunity for good education, remunerative employment, comfortable housing, good clothing and effective and compassionate medical care." Norman Borlaug

Lynnie

I saw that last sentence, too. They were probably rethinking what they were thinking when they were saying what they were saying specifically, pointedly and quite direct about the American Flag. Holding it (American Flag) inclusive to a news source lets them off the hook a tad......but, just a tad.

Afterall, America is a melting pot and is there a better symbol than the American Flag to show that apartment complex's diversity?

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Who is Lynnie?? ~~~~~~~Signed, All Y'all

jdarg

Is it private property?

Lynnie

Good point. The article doesn't address this, but usually apartments are privately owned.

I would still fly my American Flag, however. If it meant eviction, I would gladly leave a slum lord like that.

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Who is Lynnie?? ~~~~~~~Signed, All Y'all

Santiago

edit: Personal attacks are not allowed on SoWal.com

jdarg

I would probably leave too.

It is very much a non story if it is private property- where are the personal property rights people? The owner should be able to make the rules for his own land, right?

Lynnie

I don't know? But, when you're renting the rights to someone else???

Their local news thought it was a pretty viable story.

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Who is Lynnie?? ~~~~~~~Signed, All Y'all

jdarg

I think it would be a story if the landlord denied them running water or electricity or access to the building, but is it a legal right to be able to display the flag on property that does not belong to you? What if the same tenant was denied the right to display a swastika? Is that a story? I'm still not saying I agree with the landlord, but I find these type of things interesting.

The reporting news channels knew this would be a draw- you are smart enough to know that.

Lynnie

You're right. It's not newsworthy.

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Who is Lynnie?? ~~~~~~~Signed, All Y'all

CSully

Now, to be clear...I believe this is ridiculous and I am baffled why anyone would do this....however, SunSpot...I'd guess that a big part of your political ideology has to do with the US Government staying out and off of your "personal property". If I am wrong in assuming this, I apologize. However, if I am right.....isn't that all the ACLU is defending in this case? A persons right to not have other people (or the g'vmt) tell them what to do on their own personal property? The apartment buling in question is "private property"...just b/c we don't agree with the persons opinion doesn't give them less rights as an American. Ever.

Lynnie

Holy Smokes! The ACLU is now involved? Is it confirmed that it is private property? And, is this in their leases? I don't know about OR, but in states I am aware, tenants have rights unless otherwise outlined in a lease, which is legal and binding.

If they want to implement a change, the leases must properly be amended. To discuss eviction with a tenant over an 'unknown' right seems over the top. Were they served notices in writing or threatened verbally? Evidently, the complex did see the error of their ways and retracted their 'new rule.'

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Who is Lynnie?? ~~~~~~~Signed, All Y'all

Mermaid

I don't think, based on the Freedom to Display The American Flag Act of 2005 (signed a year later by then President Bush), that it's legal for the apartment manager to ban the flag. There is some wiggle room in the Act but it doesn't seem to apply to this particular situation. As follows:


H.R.42









Begun and held at the City of Washington on Tuesday,


the third day of January, two thousand and six


An Act


To ensure that the right of an individual to display the flag of the United States on residential property not be abridged.

Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled,



SECTION 1. SHORT TITLE.

This Act may be cited as the `Freedom to Display the American Flag Act of 2005'.



SEC. 2. DEFINITIONS.

For purposes of this Act--

(1) the term `flag of the United States' has the meaning given the term `flag, standard, colors, or ensign' under section 3 of title 4, United States Code;


(2) the terms `condominium association' and `cooperative association' have the meanings given such terms under section 604 of Public Law 96-399 (15 U.S.C. 3603);


(3) the term `residential real estate management association' has the meaning given such term under section 528 of the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 (26 U.S.C. 528); and


(4) the term `member'--

(A) as used with respect to a condominium association, means an owner of a condominium unit (as defined under section 604 of Public Law 96-399 (15 U.S.C. 3603)) within such association;


(B) as used with respect to a cooperative association, means a cooperative unit owner (as defined under section 604 of Public Law 96-399 (15 U.S.C. 3603)) within such association; and


(C) as used with respect to a residential real estate management association, means an owner of a residential property within a subdivision, development, or similar area subject to any policy or restriction adopted by such association.





SEC. 3. RIGHT TO DISPLAY THE FLAG OF THE UNITED STATES.

A condominium association, cooperative association, or residential real estate management association may not adopt or enforce any policy, or enter into any agreement, that would restrict or prevent a member of the association from displaying the flag of the United States on residential property within the association with respect to which such member has a separate ownership interest or a right to exclusive possession or use.



SEC. 4. LIMITATIONS.

Nothing in this Act shall be considered to permit any display or use that is inconsistent with--

(1) any provision of chapter 1 of title 4, United States Code, or any rule or custom pertaining to the proper display or use of the flag of the United States (as established pursuant to such chapter or any otherwise applicable provision of law); or


(2) any reasonable restriction pertaining to the time, place, or manner of displaying the flag of the United States necessary to protect a substantial interest of the condominium association, cooperative association, or residential real estate management association.





Speaker of the House of Representatives.


Vice President of the United States and


President of the Senate

__________________
I was outed twice now in my life--the first time by my sister in high school...the second time was right here on Sowal--by of all things, a dumbass mermaid--eh, go figure. ~a drama queen

jdarg

Mermy, this sounds like it applies to people who actually own property- like condos, townhomes, in 'hoods with HOAs.

A good news story would have researched the legality of it all to find out if the apartment owner or renters had the rights.

Mermaid

Thank you jdarg for approaching this in a logical manner rather than getting all huffed up with an opinion that might or might not have had anything to do the legality of the situation! It gets a little tiresome to have every topic viewed as only an opportunity to hurl insults at the other side. Facts have evidently becomes footnotes to the story rather than cornerstones. Too boring I suppose...

I think the flag act by including the term "residential real estate management association" means landlords, so this does not apply to only actual owners of real estate. And from what I understand, the last bit about reasonable restriction is where the wiggle room that is open for courtroom debate comes in. I could imagine a ban on flying those enormous flags (like the kind they wave at car dealerships) in a residential setting would not be a new story, for example.

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I was outed twice now in my life--the first time by my sister in high school...the second time was right here on Sowal--by of all things, a dumbass mermaid--eh, go figure. ~a drama queen

jdarg

I just found this one interesting, I don't know why. By tomorrow, it won't matter if the property owner or the tenant is right - because there will be so many people whipped into a frenzy by news stories only reporting one side. If the tenants are right, then report the law backing it up. Even if the property owner is in the legal right, he will most likely want to move!

Mermaid

I think it's interesting, too. It makes me think back to 9/11/01. Within days every bumper sported an American flag decal and sales of our flag went through the roof. Everyone wanted to display a flag. And now??

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I was outed twice now in my life--the first time by my sister in high school...the second time was right here on Sowal--by of all things, a dumbass mermaid--eh, go figure. ~a drama queen

AlphaCrab

[quote=Mermaid;618685]I think it's interesting, too. It makes me think back to 9/11/01. Within days every bumper sported an American flag decal and sales of our flag went through the roof. Everyone wanted to display a flag. And now??[/quote]

...And now...The story is dead, this thread is dead, and I am going to bed.

__________________
Abrupt and needed "change" is hard for anyone to deal with. We have to deal with new paradigms in a new world, but I think things are gradually getting better!

AlphaCrab

In my online community in Pa. (my former residence) personal attacks like that were deemed not acceptible and inappropriate--I guess that is just not the case here.

__________________
Abrupt and needed "change" is hard for anyone to deal with. We have to deal with new paradigms in a new world, but I think things are gradually getting better!

Mermaid

[quote=AlphaCrab;618688]Oh, please don't let us stop you.

__________________
I was outed twice now in my life--the first time by my sister in high school...the second time was right here on Sowal--by of all things, a dumbass mermaid--eh, go figure. ~a drama queen

jdarg

This is very complicated- which is probably why the news story was pretty short and sweet- way above most TV news quickies. This stuff would put most people to sleep.

From the following article, I am still reading that apartment complex owners are not the same as residential real estate management associations. And also, there are apparently several individual state rules that trump the fed rules. (I think it said to not assume that the federal law preempts the state law).


Guidance for Complying with the Freedom to Display the American Flag Act of 2005

Mermy I don't know how you did so much HOA research-- your eyes must have glazed over.

Santiago

edit: Personal attacks are not allowed on SoWal.com

Mermaid

It was actually condominium law I was studying, not HOAs--in Florida there are slight but important nuances between the two. I am glad to say, however, that Florida legislature passed the following last fall, for condominiums:

FS 718.113(4) Any unit owner may display one portable, removable United States flag in a respectful way and, on Armed Forces Day, Memorial Day, Flag Day, Independence Day, and Veterans Day, may display in a respectful way, portable, removable official flags, not larger than 4 1/2' by 6', that represent the United States Army, Navy, Air Force, Marine Corps, or Coast Guard, regardless of any declaration rules or requirements dealing with flags or decorations.

BTW, my statutes booklet also states that the Florida legislature says it is now perfectly legal for condo owners in this state to have wash lines to dry their clothes. Somehow I think a person exercising his rights in a million dollar plus condo development would draw far more ire doing that than displaying an American flag.

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I was outed twice now in my life--the first time by my sister in high school...the second time was right here on Sowal--by of all things, a dumbass mermaid--eh, go figure. ~a drama queen

poppy

If while renting a condo on the beach one were told to remove their American flag towel draped over the railing or be evicted, would Fox News get up in arms over this when in fact all towels on railings are banned? Of course they would because it feeds to the "America is being destroyed" crowd they pander to.

__________________
"We must recognize the fact that adequate food is only the first requisite for life. For a decent and humane life we must also provide an opportunity for good education, remunerative employment, comfortable housing, good clothing and effective and compassionate medical care." Norman Borlaug

Here4Good

I like this part in the second article:

"KVAL News asked whether she had talked to the resident who originally went to the media with the story. Holcomb said no, although she said she would talk to him -- and would have talked to him before he went to the media. Holcomb said he did not approach her before talking to KVAL News partner KATU. "He's just a romping, stomping patriot," Holcomb said."

So, instead of contacting the landlord and talking to him about it, this guy immediately calls Fox News.

This is not a story, this is a made-up issue.

poppy

Are you suggesting we now vote people off the board because we disagree with their posts? Suck it up and reply with a lengthy rebuttal or a one liner instead of calling them names and acting like a child. There would be no fun in posting if we all held the same views.

__________________
"We must recognize the fact that adequate food is only the first requisite for life. For a decent and humane life we must also provide an opportunity for good education, remunerative employment, comfortable housing, good clothing and effective and compassionate medical care." Norman Borlaug

Santiago

No poppy, I wasn't suggesting anything. I was just reacting to every thought that this guy has being a slam to conservatives, George Bush, Fox News, etc. It seems to me that everyone having the same views is exactly what you want.

poppy

You need to read and comprehend my entire post before responding. Here's my viewpoint you failed to grasp - -

__________________
"We must recognize the fact that adequate food is only the first requisite for life. For a decent and humane life we must also provide an opportunity for good education, remunerative employment, comfortable housing, good clothing and effective and compassionate medical care." Norman Borlaug

BobbyB

OK... I just read this whole thread and whether you are liberal conservative or neither, whether you were born in America or chose to move here, we are all given one unalienable right that is protected by the flag...
IF YOU DON"T LIKE IT YOU HAVE THE RIGHT TO LEAVE.
The american flag stands for whichever side you believe and it also stands for the diversity of this great country whether you agree with Alpha or Santiago.
The American Flag should be the only symbol of such that is truly 100% protected by the law as we ALL live in America, this right should be protected unconditionally anywhere and everywhere within our borders. MANY HAVE DIED FOR THAT RIGHT.

BobbyB

It IS news when someone tries to take that right from someone else no matter which side reports it, you all should be offended if someone tells you that you can not fly the flag or if someone says something derogatory about our country.
You may have a problem with the right or with the left, but if you have a problem with America as a whole then you just don't belong here.

kkddbb

these people were told that it might offend someone. how does an american flag offend someone unless your a left wing loon that blames america for everything because some leftist on tv tells you too. quit defending such stupidity and look at this for what it is

kkddbb

fox noise? did olby teach you that one? right wing conspiracy? did hillary teach you that one? do you have thoughts of your own or are you happy to be the victim of political bomb throwers? im sure glad im not a robot to hate. you only do a disservice to yourself by not knowing whats going on in the world around you

Yzarctoo

I think someone got up on the wrong side of the bed this morning. Its a flag for pete sake!!!!! Nothing right or left. A FLAG!!!!!!

Lynnie

No Lie:

After 9/11/01, when this nation was unified for a moment and there was a run on American Flags, someone made the statement, "Why would anyone make a pledge of allegiance to a flag anyway?"

I challenged the PhD candidate to review the words right after, "I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America........"

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Who is Lynnie?? ~~~~~~~Signed, All Y'all

poppy

Sorry for the double post, but I have to ask. What are your thoughts on this individual, an extreme right winger with an obvious mental deficiency or right on the money with these rants that are a rewording of every response they ever posted?

__________________
"We must recognize the fact that adequate food is only the first requisite for life. For a decent and humane life we must also provide an opportunity for good education, remunerative employment, comfortable housing, good clothing and effective and compassionate medical care." Norman Borlaug

poppy

I have never defended you.

__________________
"We must recognize the fact that adequate food is only the first requisite for life. For a decent and humane life we must also provide an opportunity for good education, remunerative employment, comfortable housing, good clothing and effective and compassionate medical care." Norman Borlaug

Here4Good

Serioiusly, you guys, if Mr. Offended had simply gone to the landlord and stated his objections, this would have been solved and Fox would not have had a story.

Instead, it's another manufactured problem which could have been solved at a much lower volume, if everyone had acted like a human being instead of leaping at the opportunity to get their panties in a wad.

We are becoming a nation of Jerry Springer loving drama queens.

sunspotbaby

Thanks for your post and (to the lion's den)

I do think flying our American flag should be protected. Granted, there could be restrictions on size, etc for private property, but our flag represents our freedom and men & women die every day for that freedom. No one is going to tell me what i can put on my car for sure.

__________________
Don't confuse having less with being less, having more with being more, or what you have with who you are. Noah benShea

Bob

do you wish to live in a country of blind, hyper patriotism that kindles hate for anyone who is different?

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CSully

Yeah, either that or you may love the first amendment to the Constitution of our country and ALL that it entails....

sunspotbaby

huh?

__________________
Don't confuse having less with being less, having more with being more, or what you have with who you are. Noah benShea

Bob

there can be too much of a good thing....the omnipresent flag helped fuel two unnecessary wars.

sunspotbaby

I agree, but we're not talking about the entire country marching around with our flags... don't go extreme on me bob.

__________________
Don't confuse having less with being less, having more with being more, or what you have with who you are. Noah benShea

mtlinscomb

i see the nurses forgot to make bob take his pills this morning