Kennedy's grandson invokes God for healthcare reform
When Sarah Palin made a statement regarding death panels and her down syndrome child, it was labeled, "heartless exploitation", in this short clip, we see religion and politricks in a tasteless display of opportunism.
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"For me, Truth is a kind of holy grail. I believe that Truth and Ideology are often at war with one another, and my allegiance is to Truth"
When Sarah Palin made a statement regarding death panels and her down syndrome child, it was labeled, "heartless exploitation", in this short clip, we see religion and politricks in a tasteless display of opportunism.
Put anyone on the right in the casket and the left would be going @pe$hit! Kennedy, Barry and Nancy can bring up God and the Lord any time they wish and it becomes a heartwarming moment. If you are a conservative, you best keep that God talk to yourself. It appears their hypocrisy knows no bounds.
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How tacky - praying at someone's funeral that something they had been crusading for up until the moment they died comes true.
Seriously, have you guys never been to a mass before?
There's always a long list of stuff that gets prayed for - stuff going on in the parish, sick people, dead relatives, leaders - both secular and religious, the future, current events, charities etc.
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How tacky - praying at someone's funeral that something they had been crusading for up until the moment they died comes true.
Seriously, have you guys never been to a mass before?
There's always a long list of stuff that gets prayed for - stuff going on in the parish, sick people, dead relatives, leaders - both secular and religious, the future, current events, charities etc.
SO, YOUR SAYING THIS WASNT POLITICAL?
TO PRAY FOR GOOD HEALTH FOR ALL IS ONE THING, TO PRAY FOR A HEALTH REFORM BILL IS PURE POLITICS.
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How tacky - praying at someone's funeral that something they had been crusading for up until the moment they died comes true.
Seriously, have you guys never been to a mass before?
There's always a long list of stuff that gets prayed for - stuff going on in the parish, sick people, dead relatives, leaders - both secular and religious, the future, current events, charities etc.
I've been to hundreds of masses. It would be "normal" to pray for something like this unless your party was pushing to name a healthcare bill after you. This is about as duplicitous as Obama's appearance at Georgetown university last in April when he asked for the christian symbols to be hidden from camera view, then a few days ago appearing on a conference call with religious leaders, claiming that opponets of the healthcare bill are "bearing false witness"
Useful idiots!
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The funeral mass was held at Our Lady of Perpetual Help Basilica church in Boston. Seems to me that God is a pretty standard mention in prayer at funerals in churches. I doubt you'd get any lip from even the most secular of us.
"Just as the country put into effect the civil rights legislation that JFK had been pushing for after his death -- as a tribute to him, there is a parallel with his brother EMK. Ted Kennedy worked for many causes over the years. Many have admitted that with Kennedy sidelined with brain cancer the current healthcare reform has suffered.
What else would you expect at the funeral of a CAREER POLITICIAN? Of COURSE it's going to be politicized. And healthcare for all Americans just happened to be one of Ted Kennedy's pet projects.
When his sister Eunice Kennedy Shriver died and they tied it in with the Special Olympics was that a problem for you people? I doubt it.
I was too young to pay attention, but I am 99.99% sure that when Martin Luther King died they talked about civil rights -- his legacy -- at his funeral. When you are talking about a man (or woman) whose life has been devoted to a cause, why would you shy away from that fact in eulogizing him/her?"
I've been to hundreds of masses. It would be "normal" to pray for something like this unless your party was pushing to name a healthcare bill after you. This is about as duplicitous as Obama's appearance at Georgetown university last in April when he asked for the christian symbols to be hidden from camera view, then a few days ago appearing on a conference call with religious leaders, claiming that opponets of the healthcare bill are "bearing false witness"
Useful idiots!
It makes sense if you think about the fact that to Kennedy, and to many others in this country who believe a fairer health care system is sorely needed to replace the mishmash cluster&$^% that we have today, this has always been a deeply moral issue and not a political one.
The child was not even praying for "universal health care," just coverage for all and a fairer system. Tell me how that is truly political. If he had said, "pray for the passage of the House bill unchanged," it would be another story.
And yes, as many have pointed out, it was the cause of Kennedy's life and his decades in the Senate. The storyline has developed in a unique way when you consider modern American history. It is as if Congress were getting ready to pass a bill that cuts government by 25 percent and Ron Paul were on his deathbed, or a steadfast, long-serving pro-lifer were dying just as Congress was trying to gather the votes to overturn Roe v. Wade. Would you then see it as a political issue?
The closest real-life example I can think of is JFK's interest in civil rights, and how the Civil Rights Act of 1964 was passed in his name. However it would have never been discussed at his funeral because his death was such a shock.
Seriously, those who are worked up over this need to be more specific and constructive.
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When Sarah Palin made a statement regarding death panels and her down syndrome child, it was labeled, "heartless exploitation", in this short clip, we see religion and politricks in a tasteless display of opportunism.
oh my cod, not sure how these situations/words even begin to compare. why not just state your case without such inadequate analogies? your opinion is your opinion. state it. no problemo.
It makes sense if you think about the fact that to Kennedy, and to many others in this country who believe a fairer health care system is sorely needed to replace the mishmash cluster&$^% that we have today, this has always been a deeply moral issue and not a political one.
The child was not even praying for "universal health care," just coverage for all and a fairer system. Tell me how that is truly political. If he had said, "pray for the passage of the House bill unchanged," it would be another story.
And yes, as many have pointed out, it was the cause of Kennedy's life and his decades in the Senate. The storyline has developed in a unique way when you consider modern American history. It is as if Congress were getting ready to pass a bill that cuts government by 25 percent and Ron Paul were on his deathbed, or a steadfast, long-serving pro-lifer were dying just as Congress was trying to gather the votes to overturn Roe v. Wade. Would you then see it as a political issue?
The closest real-life example I can think of is JFK's interest in civil rights, and how the Civil Rights Act of 1964 was passed in his name. However it would have never been discussed at his funeral because his death was such a shock.
Seriously, those who are worked up over this need to be more specific and constructive.
oh my cod, not sure how these situations/words even begin to compare of have any parallels whatsoever. why not just state your case without such inadequate analogies? your opinion is your opinion. state it. no problemo.
see post # 7 for more specifics
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The funeral mass was held at Our Lady of Perpetual Help Basilica church in Boston. Seems to me that God is a pretty standard mention in prayer at funerals in churches. I doubt you'd get any lip from even the most secular of us.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tootsie
oh my cod, not sure how these situations/words even begin to compare of have any parallels whatsoever. why not just state your case without such inadequate analogies? your opinion is your opinion. state it. no problemo.
Why is it not a fair comparison? Palin uses her family as an example in promoting her view, Kennedy's grandson uses his family to promote his view. What is the difference except one is conservative and one is liberal? I don't have a problem with either example, but I am intellectually honest enough to say that they are the same thing.
The more the far right pushes crap like this, the more I feel sorry for their kind.....
Give it a rest.....comparing something that an idiot like Palin said to a teenage boy who just lost his Grandfather and trying to spin it in a political manner.....pathetic.
And you just can't figure why the majority of America voted AGAINST your ideas....?
Why is it not a fair comparison? Palin uses her family as an example in promoting her view, Kennedy's grandson uses his family to promote his view. What is the difference except one is conservative and one is liberal? I don't have a problem with either example, but I am intellectually honest enough to say that they are the same thing.
I'm surprised some of the birthers and deathers didn't crash the funeral and stage a shout down.
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Kennedy's grandson made a prayer that his grandfather's lifelong efforts to provide affordable health care might prevail. I don't see one similarity at all to the misguided rambling scare tactics that Palin pronounces. Gimme a break....
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The more the far right pushes crap like this, the more I feel sorry for their kind.....
Give it a rest.....comparing something that an idiot like Palin said to a teenage boy who just lost his Grandfather and trying to spin it in a political manner.....pathetic.
And you just can't figure why the majority of America voted AGAINST your ideas....?
Don't ask the far right to make comparisons or analogies. They don't get it. I don't think it's in their DNA.
There are crazies on all sides. I cannot imagine someone protesting at a funeral for any reason. Such an act is inexcuseable and tasteless to the extreme. I particularly cannot imagine someone who calls themselves Christian participating in such an act. I can only guess that they have spent more time printing their vile signs than actually reading the Bible. Baptists should sue them for copyright infringement.
All I wish is that liberals could learn to condemn their own crazies.
There are crazies on all sides. I cannot imagine someone protesting at a funeral for any reason. Such an act is inexcuseable and tasteless to the extreme. I particularly cannot imagine someone who calls themselves Christian participating in such an act. I can only guess that they have spent more time printing their vile signs than actually reading the Bible. Baptists should sue them for copyright infringement.
All I wish is that liberals could learn to condemn their own crazies.
And I wish that conservatives could learn to condemn their OWN crazies....
Perhaps you could start by modifying your previous statement:
"No, only liberals would be tacky enough to disrupt a funeral"
I have NO respect for anyone who interupts and/or protests a sacred event such as a funeral. This includes trying to take a political spin on what a mourning grandson says at his grandfather's funeral.....
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And I wish that conservatives could learn to condemn their OWN crazies....
Perhaps you could start by modifying your previous statement:
"No, only liberals would be tacky enough to disrupt a funeral"
Arkie, I agree with you that the statement should be revised but for different reasons. You seem to be stuck on the idea that it isn't only liberals who disrupt funerals (but that it is conservatives as well)...
I believe that only nuts do such things and that it is neither one's liberal nor conservative ideologies that would motivate them...
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arkiehawg
I have NO respect for anyone who interupts and/or protests a sacred event such as a funeral. This includes trying to take a political spin on what a mourning grandson says at his grandfather's funeral.....
I did not place a "political spin" on the grandson's prayer. I said that liberals, including members of his family, are using Mr. Kennedy's death to advance an agenda. Were Mr. Kennedy alive, I am sure he would encourage the effort. And I don't see a problem with that.
What I do have a problem with is the left wing smear attacks on Ms. Palin for basically doing the same thing: using an example in her personal life to further her agenda.
Let's just be consistent in our conversation, all I am asking for.
Arkie, I agree with you that the statement should be revised but for different reasons. You seem to be stuck on the idea that it isn't only liberals who disrupt funerals (but that it is conservatives as well)...
I believe that only nuts do such things and that it is neither one's liberal nor conservative ideologies that would motivate them...
I respectfully disagree. While they may be "nuts" they are driven by their ideologies rather that be radically conservative or liberal.
My point initially was to counter the comment that :
"No, only liberals would be tacky enough to disrupt a funeral"
I did not place a "political spin" on the grandson's prayer. I said that liberals, including members of his family, are using Mr. Kennedy's death to advance an agenda. Were Mr. Kennedy alive, I am sure he would encourage the effort. And I don't see a problem with that.
What I do have a problem with is the left wing smear attacks on Ms. Palin for basically doing the same thing: using an example in her personal life to further her agenda.
Let's just be consistent in our conversation, all I am asking for.
My comment on political spin was not directed at you but the original poster of this thread....
My only issue with your comments are the inaccuracy of your comment that only liberals would protest at a funeral....which you still haven't corrected.....
(Posted before your correction....nice adjustment on the initial comment)...+2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arkiehawg
I respectfully disagree. While they may be "nuts" they are driven by their ideologies rather that be radically conservative or liberal.
My point initially was to counter the comment that :
"No, only liberals would be tacky enough to disrupt a funeral"
Geo is right, the cause is not what drives these people, it is their mental defect.
I am as conservative as you will find, but I would not think of disrupting a funeral of anyone. And if you look, I have tried to be respectful of Mr. Kennedy during the mourning period. While I have strong feelings about him and his politics, others respected and revered him. There is a time for everything.
Looking back, I regret even responding to this thread. While I feel liberals have unfairly attacked Ms. Palin; in retrospect, this was not the forum to air those sentiments. If I offended anyone, I apologize.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arkiehawg
My comment on political spin was not directed at you but the original poster of this thread....
My only issue with your comments are the inaccuracy of your comment that only liberals would protest at a funeral....which you still haven't corrected.....
(Posted before your correction....nice adjustment on the initial comment)...+2
Actually the edit makes my point better. If I could afford another salary I would try and hire you as my editor in chief.
Conservatives are prolife. Nuts bomb abortion clinics.
Conservatives oppose healthcare reform because we don't have the money to pay for it and they are concerned that gov't will get bigger and private enterprise will suffer. Nuts literally believe our president supports a nazi agenda.
Playing DA here...are any people bothered by the fact that the family scripted the grandchildren to make these statements about healthcare? I seriously doubt that those boys came up with those thoughts on their grandfather. At most funerals I have attended, the grandchildren tell some sentimental story about their grandparent that had meaning to them.
IJS
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I've been to hundreds of masses. It would be "normal" to pray for something like this unless your party was pushing to name a healthcare bill after you. This is about as duplicitous as Obama's appearance at Georgetown university last in April when he asked for the christian symbols to be hidden from camera view, then a few days ago appearing on a conference call with religious leaders, claiming that opponets of the healthcare bill are "bearing false witness"
Useful idiots!
Another knee jerk reaction from persecuted Christians. Had he spoke with the symbol behind him we would have heard an uproar over a Marxist/communist Islamist (and other "ists") disrespecting a Christian place of worship. It never ends.
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Playing DA here...are any people bothered by the fact that the family scripted the grandchildren to make these statements about healthcare? I seriously doubt that those boys came up with those thoughts on their grandfather. At most funerals I have attended, the grandchildren tell some sentimental story about their grandparent that had meaning to them.
IJS
I thought about that aspect. I've often seen kids "used" by adults to get their agenda pushed forward and it really irks me to no end. But you never know - he may have asked to say something about his grandfather's great wish for health care for all. The Kennedy's know politics and I am certain that this child has heard about the bickering going on in this nation regarding the simple quest to have all people covered and perhaps wanted to honor his legacy by mentioning it. Can't this just be accepted as that?
Playing DA here...are any people bothered by the fact that the family scripted the grandchildren to make these statements about healthcare? I seriously doubt that those boys came up with those thoughts on their grandfather. At most funerals I have attended, the grandchildren tell some sentimental story about their grandparent that had meaning to them.
IJS
I definitely see your point here. no doubt there were scripted statements. but there were also sentimental stories told. a few made me sniffle.
but I think the point is that the man who died has worked for decades on providing real health care to all americans, that it is a moral issue, that americans have a right to good health care, that the current health care system is a disease system. I think it is good and right and timely to talk about what he stood for and worked for over many years.
I also see how others who did not like the man, or who are against national health care, to find fault in the fact that Ted's death was used as an political opportunity. Perhaps the issue of health care could have been omitted from funeral services.. perhaps the issue could have been set aside and then discussed in relation to Ted's work, in other forums. who knows. I guess its judged purely by which side of the aisle you are sitting.
Last edited by Teresa; 09-01-2009 at 09:13 AM.
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I guess you are correct then.....Perhaps Ms Palin is just plain nuts and it has nothing to do with her conservativeness....
Just couldn't resist....sorry....
Maybe you should.
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Um... Aren't they a bunch of psycho Xian wingnuts???
You must be joking!
it is sheer entertainment.
But I do 
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