Life may take VISA, but Government Offices Cant

Chief Deputy TC · 05-01-2009, 01:59 PM

Tax Collector’s Office No Longer Accepting VISA Cards

DeFuniak Springs, FL (April 30, 2009) – As of May 1, VISA cards are no longer accepted at the Walton County Tax Collector’s Office due to restrictions placed on government agencies by VISA.

VISA is requiring government agencies, including the Tax Collector's Office, to sign merchant agreements that would force them to pass on VISA's charges to all customers, not just those who are using their credit cards at the counter.

MasterCard, American Express & Discover continue to be accepted by the Tax Collector's Office at the counter, through the mail, telephone and online at Walton County Tax Collector. Because of VISA's order, the Tax Collector's Office will no longer be able to accept VISA debit or credit cards for any transactions.

Tax Collector Rhonda Skipper said "It is the policy of my office that if a customer wants to have the convenience of using a credit card or debit card, then the card holder, not all tax payers, should bear those additional costs. VISA’s policy would require all tax payers to share the cost of using their card and I simply cannot pass those fees on to all customers."

The State of Florida has already weighed in on this issue by authorizing governing agencies conducting state business to accept credit and debit card payments and charge a convenience fee that is collected by a third party payment processor. MasterCard, American Express & Discover have not expressed any objections to the current arrangement and continue to be accepted for all transaction types.

"When I dine out and pay with cash, I know the price includes additional costs that allow someone else to use their VISA card. As Tax Collector, I can't do that. I am unable to add a little more onto everyone's tax bill to cover the other customer’s VISA costs," said Skipper.

“Our office tried to work out an agreement that would allow us to continue taking VISA, however, VISA’s rigid policy and unwillingness to work within my obligations to the taxpayers of Walton County, has resulted in us no longer being able to process VISA cards,” said Skipper. “I realize this is an inconvenience to our customers and would encourage those who are VISA cardholders to contact VISA directly.”

Customers can speak directly with VISA by calling (800) VISA-911 or via email at askvisa@visa.com.

“VISA it’s everywhere you want to be except government agencies, “said Skipper.

scooterbug44 · 05-01-2009, 02:05 PM

Good! Way to take a stand!

These credit card companies are long overdue for a reality check IMO!

TooFarTampa · 05-01-2009, 02:10 PM

Good post -- I'm glad Rhonda Skipper's office made this decision.

This is the kind of thing that is right up Crist's alley and frankly, he should call Visa out on it loudly and very publicly. In fact, I can see this becoming a national issue and very bad PR for Visa. Idiots.

Chief Deputy TC · 05-01-2009, 02:15 PM

Thanks,

Many other Florida Tax Collectors have also adopted this policy with VISA. I hope they relax their regulations on government offices as ALL the other major credit card companies have. The unfortunate part is that the majority of our customers who choose this payment option are VISA cardholders. This is primarily due to the contractual relationships they have with so many banks.

I hope I can send an update soon that announces we can accept VISA, but for now they have chosen to loose money and frustrate their cardholders.

Lynnie · 05-01-2009, 02:15 PM

I think boycotting AMEX just for their high fees would be a good move as well.

I am anti AMEX these days..........

Chief Deputy TC · 05-01-2009, 02:23 PM

Suggested Letter or e mail to VISA :

Joseph W. Saunders
Chairman & Chief Executive Officer
Visa Inc.
P.O. Box 8999
San Francisco, CA 94128 - 8999

Dear Mr. Saunders,

I wanted to use my Visa card at the Tax Collector’s Office in Walton
County, Florida. However, Visa does not allow their customers to use
a Visa card at the Tax Collector’s Office.

This makes no sense as MasterCard, American Express & Discover
are accepted by the Tax Collector’s Office.

It is my understanding that VISA has ordered government agencies to
not conduct lawful counter service payment transactions for tax
payments, such as vehicle registration and business taxes. Such
agencies cannot readily afford to accept Visa at the counter without
using convenience fees as allowed under Florida law.

Please reconsider Visa’s policy in this matter and allow the Tax
Collector’s Office and other government agencies to accept Visa
payments.

Sincerely,

_____________________________________
an inconvenienced customer trying to use a Visa card

goodwitch58 · 05-01-2009, 02:31 PM

Thanks for taking this stand and also for getting the information out in a timely manner; and with information for all residents to contact the credit card company. This is great.

These credit card companies need a "wake-up" call--this is a good start. I appreciate what you all did, and especially that you posted here on Sowal.

TooFarTampa · 05-01-2009, 02:47 PM

Cory you say there are other counties who have made the same decision. ARe some deciding to have taxpayers pay the fees? It seems this decision by VISA would have a pretty far reach. If other counties are accepting VISA and passing the fees on to taxpayers, those taxpayers have an absolute right to know -- immediately.

Chief Deputy TC · 05-01-2009, 04:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TooFarTampa

Cory you say there are other counties who have made the same decision. ARe some deciding to have taxpayers pay the fees? It seems this decision by VISA would have a pretty far reach. If other counties are accepting VISA and passing the fees on to taxpayers, those taxpayers have an absolute right to know -- immediately.

This thing moved very quickly this week and I am sure many offices are still trying to decide on a course of action. As soon as I got the request that we sign a "merchant agreement" I knew something was up, as our payment processor has always been identified as the "merchant of record". That put's the burden on the third party to adhere to the card regulations. Our payment processor, Point and Pay, Inc. is a leader in this industry and they were on top of it. In the coming days and weeks, you should see other government offices follow this course. Never in a million years would I have assumed I would be spending any significant portion of my day determining a strategy to comply with a credit card company who wished to not have their card accepted. Hopefully it was an experiment to see if they could get us to pay, thus more $. Now they need to decide is some is better than none from government agencies.

Here is a quote from them from 2005, " "Partnering with governments is a strategic priority for Visa and its members to help them achieve a variety of goals," said Aliza Knox, senior vice president, Commercial Solutions, Visa International.

I will be on Grayton Beach surf fishing this weekend to decompress from all this!!!

Lynnie · 05-01-2009, 05:27 PM

I've never paid my taxes 'conveniently' on line due to the ridiculously high 'convenience' charge. Not a Walton Co. charge, but I don't think it's a VISA charge either.

ShallowsNole · 05-02-2009, 01:13 PM

And both of the banks I use have replaced my old atm and debit cards with VISA debit cards, effective yesterday.

SWGB · 05-02-2009, 04:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShallowsNole

And both of the banks I use have replaced my old atm and debit cards with VISA debit cards, effective yesterday.

That sucks, just used my MC check card at the county office the other day. Just $40 and I got a brand new license plate.

Snerd · 05-02-2009, 05:29 PM

Visa isn't forcing fees for every single transaction or every single customer, they just want the tax collector to pay the same fees as every other business. Of course this expense would become part of the Walton Co. Budget, so technically, yes, it is passing fees on to everyone. But I would have liked for Rhonda Skipper to be more upfront about the decision like this article from the Orlando Sentinel.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Life may take Visa, but Orlando area tax offices might not
By Jeannette Rivera-Lyles
Sentinel Staff Writer
May 1, 2009

Central Florida tax collectors are dropping Visa over a dispute about a fee to cover credit-card transaction costs.

As of today, the Orange County tax collector will stop honoring Visa cards for any kind of transaction at any of the offices and on the Web site.

Tax collectors in Osceola, Polk, Lake and Volusia counties, for now, will accept Visa online but not at any of their offices. They say they have no other choice because Visa is prohibiting them from charging a user fee to cover what it costs to process payments made with the cards.

"I can't eat that cost," said Polk County Tax Collector Joe Tedder. "And I can't add a little bit more to your tax bill to cover the cost of processing the credit card you might or might not use."

Florida law does not allow government agencies to spread the cost of the transactions to all of their customers, especially those who pay with cash.

Merchants cover that expense by adding it to their prices.

The tax collectors' decisions apply to more than property-tax payments. The decisions extend to drivers-license renewals, car-tag fees, occupational licenses, and fishing and hunting permits. In an e-mail, a Visa spokesman said the situation was a misunderstanding but would not elaborate.

"Visa Inc. does allow U.S. merchants to charge convenience fees on Visa transactions if they meet certain criteria," Ted Carr said. "Acceptable convenience fees are always flat or fixed, not a percentage of the sale, and must be included in the total transaction amount."

But the tax collectors say Visa told them to stop charging the user fees or they could face legal repercussions.

Tedder calls Visa's stance a bullying tactic.

"Visa believes they are the big dog on campus," he said. "They dominate the market, so they think they can dictate policy in this area. Fine. We choose not to do business with them."

ShallowsNole · 05-02-2009, 09:43 PM

I don't know how Rhonda could have been any more upfront about it than she was - from Deputy Chief Cory's post above, she and Cory are saying exactly the same thing that Joe Tedder from Polk County is saying. At least, that's what I understood, when I read it.

I also can't speak for the Tax Collector's office, but the constitutional office I work for has to charge an upcharge on credit card payments. For example, let's look at a marriage license. A happy couple pays $93.50 if cash or check. That $93.50 is by law split into about 15 different funds. We cannot "short" those funds by absorbing credit card fees like a retail merchant can. So, the fee is tacked on top for happy couples wishing to use a credit card.

The job function I devote my work day to chose to offer payment by e-check instead of credit card, due to the size of our transactions. I will have to ask on Monday if we are still accepting Visa for the things we take credit cards for, or if we are being blindsided by this as well.

goodwitch58 · 05-02-2009, 09:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snerd

Visa isn't forcing fees for every single transaction or every single customer, they just want the tax collector to pay the same fees as every other business. Of course this expense would become part of the Walton Co. Budget, so technically, yes, it is passing fees on to everyone. But I would have liked for Rhonda Skipper to be more upfront about the decision like this article from the Orlando Sentinel.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Life may take Visa, but Orlando area tax offices might not
By Jeannette Rivera-Lyles
Sentinel Staff Writer
May 1, 2009

Central Florida tax collectors are dropping Visa over a dispute about a fee to cover credit-card transaction costs.

As of today, the Orange County tax collector will stop honoring Visa cards for any kind of transaction at any of the offices and on the Web site.

Tax collectors in Osceola, Polk, Lake and Volusia counties, for now, will accept Visa online but not at any of their offices. They say they have no other choice because Visa is prohibiting them from charging a user fee to cover what it costs to process payments made with the cards.

"I can't eat that cost," said Polk County Tax Collector Joe Tedder. "And I can't add a little bit more to your tax bill to cover the cost of processing the credit card you might or might not use."

Florida law does not allow government agencies to spread the cost of the transactions to all of their customers, especially those who pay with cash.

Merchants cover that expense by adding it to their prices.

The tax collectors' decisions apply to more than property-tax payments. The decisions extend to drivers-license renewals, car-tag fees, occupational licenses, and fishing and hunting permits. In an e-mail, a Visa spokesman said the situation was a misunderstanding but would not elaborate.

"Visa Inc. does allow U.S. merchants to charge convenience fees on Visa transactions if they meet certain criteria," Ted Carr said. "Acceptable convenience fees are always flat or fixed, not a percentage of the sale, and must be included in the total transaction amount."

But the tax collectors say Visa told them to stop charging the user fees or they could face legal repercussions.

Tedder calls Visa's stance a bullying tactic.

"Visa believes they are the big dog on campus," he said. "They dominate the market, so they think they can dictate policy in this area. Fine. We choose not to do business with them."

They both seem to be saying the same thing to me. What difference do you see in what Orange Co. and what Walton Co. did?

SWGB · 05-03-2009, 11:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snerd

Visa isn't forcing fees for every single transaction or every single customer, they just want the tax collector to pay the same fees as every other business. Of course this expense would become part of the Walton Co. Budget, so technically, yes, it is passing fees on to everyone. But I would have liked for Rhonda Skipper to be more upfront about the decision like this article from the Orlando Sentinel.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Life may take Visa, but Orlando area tax offices might not
By Jeannette Rivera-Lyles
Sentinel Staff Writer
May 1, 2009

Central Florida tax collectors are dropping Visa over a dispute about a fee to cover credit-card transaction costs.

As of today, the Orange County tax collector will stop honoring Visa cards for any kind of transaction at any of the offices and on the Web site.

Tax collectors in Osceola, Polk, Lake and Volusia counties, for now, will accept Visa online but not at any of their offices. They say they have no other choice because Visa is prohibiting them from charging a user fee to cover what it costs to process payments made with the cards.

"I can't eat that cost," said Polk County Tax Collector Joe Tedder. "And I can't add a little bit more to your tax bill to cover the cost of processing the credit card you might or might not use."

Florida law does not allow government agencies to spread the cost of the transactions to all of their customers, especially those who pay with cash.

Merchants cover that expense by adding it to their prices.

The tax collectors' decisions apply to more than property-tax payments. The decisions extend to drivers-license renewals, car-tag fees, occupational licenses, and fishing and hunting permits. In an e-mail, a Visa spokesman said the situation was a misunderstanding but would not elaborate.

"Visa Inc. does allow U.S. merchants to charge convenience fees on Visa transactions if they meet certain criteria," Ted Carr said. "Acceptable convenience fees are always flat or fixed, not a percentage of the sale, and must be included in the total transaction amount."

But the tax collectors say Visa told them to stop charging the user fees or they could face legal repercussions.

Tedder calls Visa's stance a bullying tactic.

"Visa believes they are the big dog on campus," he said. "They dominate the market, so they think they can dictate policy in this area. Fine. We choose not to do business with them."

The first mistake here is referring to government as a business. It's not. Second, everyone acts as though Visa is losing something here. Their not either. Yes, they are loosing the revenue from the processing fee that is normally deducted from the total purchase, but they are still earning the interest that accumulates on the balance collected until it is transferred to the county's coffers. Most credit card companies are about a week. Depending on how much they take in they are still making a pretty tidy profit on moving money. Factor in that many of those payments won't be paid off immediately and then you can throw in the added bonus of interest charges.

This isn't an issue of Visa hurting, it's a matter of Visa being a money hungry machine that apparently doesn't understand the concept of bad publicity over a profit not always working.