Inclusionary Zoning?

[Uncle Timmy]

Is it time for Walton County to consider an 'Inclusionary Zoning' law?

Inclusionary Zoning would require developers to include affordable housing within their developments. It would also provide incentives to make it economically feasable to do so.

Is it time to consider that a diverse mix of housing and economic levels within a community is as valuable to our infastructure as roads and utilities?

[Amp22]

:shock: Have you ever been to a BCC meeting?

I think you are way out ahead of Walton County on your thinking. Not only do developers run the show but the county can't even keep up with the paperwork, much less pave our roads.

[Donna]

If Walton County does not require inclusionary zoning as part of a jobs/housing balance soon, it will be too late for anything to make even the smallest improvement in the housing and traffic situation. What happens is that all the really big projects get built with no requirements for housing for those low-paying service jobs created, then there is a backlash from the public and only smaller (usually local players) projects are politically acceptable. Those are the players least likely to be able to provide workforce housing and they are usually more able to negotiate their way out of it with politicians. Already, the only effective workforce housing in the area will be rental housing where rents are controlled on the basis of local very low and low-income criteria. "For sale" housing is already out of reach for low-income service workers. For awhile, the north County provided affordable housing options, but it seems workers are now coming in from other states on a daily basis. Take a look at the license plates on cars traveling along Hwy. 331 headed south in the mornings and north in the evenings. Those are not necessarily tourists.

[SHELLY]

As folks are "forced by affordability" to move farther away, lower-cost housing communities start spring up farther and farther out from the upscale neighborhoods. Mid- and lower-wage employees and their families are drawn to these areas and may commute long distances for a while. Then as their hometown community grows (to a year-round working community vs. a seasonal tourist area) and infrastructure is added (schools, police, shopping, etc.) those folks tend to flock into the newly-created job market and shun the long commute. Businesses in the high-cost, upscale tourist areas may find it more lucrative to move to the far-out, year-round community where they can count on a more steady profit stream and supply of employees.

Many developers are in the profit-making, build-it, sell-it, and move-on-to-the-next-project mode. Developers do not need--nor do they care--to consider the impact of their developments on the local communities and business...unless they are FORCED into doing it. In their minds, THEY (the developers) are gracing the community with their developments and doing the community a favor by increasing the local tax revenue and providing (much needed?) jobs (or that's what they say in the pitch to the local governments).

Real Estate bulls say "it's different this time"....so when it comes to the impact the boom will have on upsetting the local economies--I have to agree on that point.

[Donna]

In CA, the creation of new jobs is not only undesirable, the developer has to pay for the creation of low to moderate-income jobs in the form of traffic impact fees and dedicated affordable housing or in lieu fees. Even in lieu fees are shunned now, because they don't translate into housing units. A developer does not dare to attend their public hearing and talk about creating new jobs. The problem with a vacation or resort community is that all the jobs created are service jobs, therefore lowest paying.

I don't necessarily agree with you about the labor base gravitating toward the newly-created critical mass. Those in need of services will be competing on the basis of wages paid, and the South County will be in a much better way to pay higher wages than will full-time communities where real estate values and incomes are lower. Our grapevine agricultural community fights every resort that rears its head in the Napa Valley, because the resorts always end up "picking off" (pun intended) the ag workers and using them as golf course maintenance people, restaurant service workers, and the like. And ag workers here are far from being minimum wage workers, the average pay more than $15/hour with benefits.

The better paying service jobs will continue to be those closest to the coastal leisure communities.

[Smiling JOe]

Many of the people developing in SoWal do not live here. Several live in Destin and Niceville, and many others live out of state. They have no reason to give a crap about what is happening or will happen. The only way the will help to fix this problem we have is for the local gov't to make them build housing for entry level service workers in their projects.

As I said not too long ago, don't be surprised in the near future when you will have to drive to Freeport to eat dinner in a restaurant.

[Jellyfish]

As I said not too long ago, don't be surprised in the near future when you will have to drive to Freeport to eat dinner in a restaurant.

Yup, just look at Aspen, LaJolla, Palm Beach, etc etc...

[SHELLY]

I don't necessarily agree with you about the labor base gravitating toward the newly-created critical mass. Those in need of services will be competing on the basis of wages paid, and the South County will be in a much better way to pay higher wages than will full-time communities where real estate values and incomes are lower. Our grapevine agricultural community fights every resort that rears its head in the Napa Valley, because the resorts always end up "picking off" (pun intended) the ag workers and using them as golf course maintenance people, restaurant service workers, and the like. And ag workers here are far from being minimum wage workers, the average pay more than $15/hour with benefits.
The better paying service jobs will continue to be those closest to the coastal leisure communities.

California has far more "ag" workers to pick from than Northwest Florida. The small "ag" areas we do have can be pretty much handled by a couple machines and a group of family and friends.

The majority of panhandle service workers were made up of family members of military personnel, retired military personnel and family members, "old timers" who've lived in the panhandle for years & years, and service workers who would travel down from "up North" for the summer who would find a cheap dive and make as much money as they could before heading back home in the Fall.

All these folks have been priced out of the Destin/South Walton area just when they needed these service workers the most.

Would you be willing to drive on Hwy 98 in the summer heat during the peak of the tourist season 2 hours round-trip @$2.50 per gallon to bus dishes for $10 per hour? Then why would you expect the folks who live within 10 minutes drive from year-round employment at their local Walmart to do it? :confused:

[Smiling JOe]

more articles from around the state with the same proplem:

www.orlandosentinel.com (http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/state/orl-keys1906feb19,0,313977.story?page=1&coll=orl-news-headlines-state)
www.sun-sentinel.com (http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/local/palmbeach/sfl-phousing23feb23,0,4009570.story?coll=sfla-news-palm)

[Smiling JOe]

News (http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/local/palmbeach/sfl-pmoratorium24feb24,0,4632732.story?page=1&coll=sfla-news-palm) article (http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/local/palmbeach/sfl-pmoratorium24feb24,0,4632732.story?page=1&coll=sfla-news-palm) from yesterday - Palm Beach County regarding Affordable Housing. It seems they are pushing for a moretorum on all developments with 50+ homes, unless the builders build affordable housing.

[Seasider]

Forcing developers to build affordable housing does not necessarily solve the problem. What happens on the resale of the affordable units? Do they stay affordable? Or do they adjust to market values? Perhaps a development, north of 98, with adequate density, could be built affordably if land could be acquired at a reasonable price, and if the county granted favorable entitlements. The homes would need to be deed restricted so that resale of the properties would be limited to a non-profit "housing authority" at a predetermined, indexed price. This non-profit group would also have to qualify the buyers to ensure that the housing is going to workforce buyers and not second homeowners or retirees, all without violating the Fair Housing Act.

[Santiago]

Forcing developers to build affordable housing does not necessarily solve the problem. What happens on the resale of the affordable units? Do they stay affordable? Or do they adjust to market values? Perhaps a development, north of 98, with adequate density, could be built affordably if land could be acquired at a reasonable price, and if the county granted favorable entitlements. The homes would need to be deed restricted so that resale of the properties would be limited to a non-profit "housing authority" at a predetermined, indexed price. This non-profit group would also have to qualify the buyers to ensure that the housing is going to workforce buyers and not second homeowners or retirees, all without violating the Fair Housing Act.
I've been waiting for someone to see the light regarding this issue. Unless everyone is talking about rental units with subsidized rents, this dog won't hunt. If I'm this $12.50 an hour dishwasher that I keep reading about on here, I'm going to relist the house before the ink drys on my mortgage. That's an easy way for this low income earner to make some real money for a change. If anyone thinks that our county government is smart enough to figure all of this out, I've got a lot in Sowal that I want to sell you where you will double your money in 6 months. Trust me.

[Smiling JOe]

I've been waiting for someone to see the light regarding this issue. Unless everyone is talking about rental units with subsidized rents, this dog won't hunt. If I'm this $12.50 an hour dishwasher that I keep reading about on here, I'm going to relist the house before the ink drys on my mortgage. That's an easy way for this low income earner to make some real money for a change. If anyone thinks that our county government is smart enough to figure all of this out, I've got a lot in Sowal that I want to sell you where you will double your money in 6 months. Trust me.Typically, with affordable housing, all net proceeds from resales within a certain time from purchase, like two years, go back into the affordable housing kitty, otherwise what you describe would happen. I do think you may be on target suggesting rental units to help solve this problem, but I know of no developer around here who wants to own management property, especially low income rental units. I cannot see the County getting into that business either.

[SHELLY]

Typically, with affordable housing, all net proceeds from resales within a certain time from purchase, like two years, go back into the affordable housing kitty, otherwise what you describe would happen. I do think you may be on target suggesting rental units to help solve this problem, but I know of no developer around here who wants to own management property, especially low income rental units. I cannot see the County getting into that business either.

That's the way I heard these schemes work too. Usually the person has to jump through a bunch of hoops to qualify and then doesn't own the rights to take full profit on the sale of the house until after living in the unit for 3 years. I'm sure the program comes with lots of administrative headaches and the county won't want their fingerprints on that train wreck if they can avoid it.

Right now the county has its hands full keeping the developers happy--developers want MAXIMUM profit with no restrictions. Once the developers are through with the area, it will then be up to the business owners to lean on the county to do something about workforce housing--by then it may be too late.

[Bob]

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/business/orl-cover2706feb27,0,5563625.story?coll=orl-dp-classifieds someone has been successful w/ affordable housing here in Florida

[30A Skunkape]

What is the definition of affordable housing? While a $150K house may seem 'affordable', can a service worker who nets a fairly low wage swing it? :idontno:

[Bob]

I think this thread is discussing owning or renting. Rentals/Apartments would be far easier to pull off given the inherent density.

[Smiling JOe]

Builders fight affordable housing measure


TALLAHASSEE, Fla. (AP) -- March 1, 2006 -- Home builders sued the city Tuesday to strike down a policy requiring them to include affordable housing in their developments because it would drive up overall housing costs, a representative said.



The Florida Home Builders Association sued in Leon County's Second Judicial Circuit Court to stop the city's inclusionary housing ordinance from continuing.



The city commission enacted the law in October to increase affordable housing for its workers. Under the law, builders must sell 10 percent of developments with 50 or more homes at a discount price, using a sliding scale that's based on what the buyer can afford, but for no less than about $160,000, and no more than close to $360,000.



Builders claim the measure raises costs by forcing buyers who pay full price for homes to subsidize affordable housing units.



''Somebody's gotta pay for that cost, otherwise I can't afford to go to work every day. If I can't afford to go to work, there's no housing,'' said Tallahassee remodeler Ed Dion.



So far, only Tallahassee has adopted the measure, but at least three counties and two other cities in Florida are considering similar policies, said Edie Ousley, the association's spokeswoman.



City Attorney Jim English said the group's allegations were unfounded.



''It was really ironic to me that, in this time period, where builders and developers and real estate agents have enjoyed unprecedented sales and unprecedented revenues and profits, that they would be challenging this really simple opportunity to provide workforce housing,'' English said.



Moreover, the law provides trade-offs for affordable housing builders, said Wayne Tedder, who directs the joint Tallahassee-Leon County planning department. For example, builders get permits to build extra full-priced units on a property, or gain exemptions from roadway improvement rules on new developments.



One affordable housing advocate said the association is reacting prematurely and should wait to see the effects of the law.



''I believe they're having a knee jerk reaction to inclusionary housing as it's been implemented in other parts of the nation,'' said Jamie Ross, spokeswoman for 1000 Friends of Florida, which is a non-profit group running affordable housing programs. ''I think they've heard horror stories from other areas that are not based in fact.''



Ross said more than 200 cities in the U.S. have inclusionary housing laws.



Copyright 2006 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed. By Andrea Fanta, Associated Press writer.

[Smiling JOe]

There is a snip-it news story (http://www.wmbb.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=WMBB%2FMGArticle%2FMBB_BasicArt icle&c=MGArticle&cid=1137834442604&path=%21news%21archives) on Ch 13 - Panama City, regarding a man wanting to build some affordable housing in SoWal.

[Rita]

SJ,
Thanks for the info and link. It is good to hear this process is in the works.
Can you further describe the state's "unwanted land"?
Rita

[Smiling JOe]

SJ,
Thanks for the info and link. It is good to hear this process is in the works.
Can you further describe the state's "unwanted land"?
Rita

Yes, the State is sometimes left disconnected parcels of land from people's wills and other methods. The State does not have enough resources (staff) to oversee these excess disconnected parcels, ranging in size from .17 acres to a few around 20 acres in size. So, the State will sometimes auction off these excess lands. I understand that these types of parcels are those which this gentleman in the story is trying to acquire for the affordable housing. It doesn't sound like he will be the sole source to cure the problem with the lack of affordable housing, but I, too, am glad to see someone making an effort to begin the process.

[Rita]

It would seem to me that disconnected parcels used in this manner would be a great idea. Larger projects sometimes take on the "labeling" of low income housing, although obviously can help more in the number of units available.