Debate

[Geo]

I only caught the last 15 minutes so it is tough to have a well informed opinion on who won, who lost, how they did and what it all means...

From what I saw, a few comments:

They are both so bright and articulate. It is incredible to me how well they can perform under intense pressure...

Don't know if this is good or bad but- Each of them masterfully dodged tough questions and yet probably came across to most folks watching as having answered and answered well (e.g. Were you wrong in opposing the surge)..

Most of the questions and answers I did see I thought Obama did a better job BUT...

Obama struck out on the last question of the night (something like- What was the biggest test of your life) and Hillary absolutely, positively KILLED it. AMAZING...

What do you folks think of the debate?

[goodwitch58]

I agree.

Perhaps we were looking at it all wrong earlier. Perhaps Hillary has been coached in the wrong way by someone.

Her last answer was right on! And, from what I'm told...that is the real Hillary. Amazing:clap:

Overall, I think it's a tie, though. They are both good candidates.

[BIGDOG]

WOW. Talk about XEROX Obama. They should never ask Hilary questions first. Obama wouldn't know what to say.

Does Obama think he's ready? Sure. But he's an egomaniac. I'm sure he thinks he's great at alot of things. The worst part. He is is shockingly unimpressive to those with analytical skills.

But this is America. Lots of stupid people do very well.

I was very impressed with Hillary. Never liked her much before, but she's extremely intelligent and has thought out and made efforts on her positions.

[Geo]

Really interesting revelation on CNN just now-

I mentioned in my first post of this thread that Hillary really nailed the last question. Obama's camp has pointed out that her answer to the question is almost verbatim what John Edwards said in an earlier debate. And it seems like the Obama Spinsters are going to use this to:

A) Diffuse the power of her magnificent answer
B) To point out that while she hammers others for borrowing from others that her best moment was in fact borrowed from someone else

Wow...

[Geo]

WOW. Talk about XEROX Obama. They should never ask Hilary questions first. Obama wouldn't know what to say.

Does Obama think he's ready? Sure. But he's an egomaniac. I'm sure he thinks he's great at alot of things. The worst part. He is is shockingly unimpressive to those with analytical skills.

But this is America. Lots of stupid people do very well.

I was very impressed with Hillary. Never liked her much before, but she's extremely intelligent and has thought out and made efforts on her positions.

BIGDOG, I agree with your takeaway on Hillary's demonstrated intelligence tonight...

But I can't say I am sharing the perception of Obama as an egomaniac. But I am intrigued and open minded. Can you sight specifics on what makes you think this?

:idontno:

[rapunzel]

BIGDOG, I agree with your takeaway on Hillary's demonstrated intelligence tonight...

But I can't say I am sharing the perception of Obama as an egomaniac. But I am intrigued and open minded. Can you sight specifics on what makes you think this?

:idontno:

Geowickey, go back and read BIGDOG's posts. S/he's done nothing but attack Barack Obama on this board both under the name BIGDOG and raven. Just FYI.

I agreed very much with your earlier observations. I missed the remark about the Edwards link. You are watching CNN?

[BIGDOG]

Geowickey, go back and read BIGDOG's posts. S/he's done nothing but attack Barack Obama on this board both under the name BIGDOG and raven. Just FYI.

I agreed very much with your earlier observations. I missed the remark about the Edwards link. You are watching CNN?

Geowicky and I are capable of our own conversation. Why are you acting like it's a crime that I don't like Obama? Last I check this was a Democracy. I don't know who "raven" is, but there's more than one person out there who might disagree with you.

[elgordoboy]

Geowicky and I are capable of our own conversation. Why are you acting like it's a crime that I don't like Obama? Last I check this was a Democracy. I don't know who "raven" is, but there's more than one person out there who might disagree with you.
If you don't want others to comment take it to PM's. :wave:

[Beach Runner]

I agree with the positive comments regarding Clinton's performance tonight. I am very proud her. I hope that she breaks the ultimate glass ceiling.

[Geo]

A number of reasons:

1) When he gave his rationale for plagiarizing Deval's speech, his response was not that he was honored to borrow the words of his eloquent friend, but that they "swap ideas" all the time. Given the fact that there is no precedent for Deval stealing from Obama's speeches, I found his answer to be defensive and dismissive of the inspiration of his "friend".

2) His facial expressions and approach to situations. He's EXTREMELY ungracious in a way that only a total narcissist can manage. I assure you I've encountered my share and I have some confidence in my assessment.

3) His televangelist/christlike image building measures. I don't need to expand on that.

He is inspriration. In my mind, he inspires a kind of facist mania that's terrifying. I'm an old-school free-thinker though, so this kind of cult worship doesn't appeal to me.

I can relate to/understand your rationale (but don't necessarily agree) with your Point #1. I threw out the word you started with ("plagarized") but you present a reasonable argument that if Obama said that they "swap" ideas that this would be valid only if Deval was using Obama's words/ideas as well and from what you are saying- this is not the case. Good point. But does this make him an egomaniac? I'm not convinced based on this...

For Point #2-
You may be right. The only narcissist I know (per my wife during marriage counseling sessions) is me. :clap: But all kidding aside, I think this is subjective and that you might be projecting this onto Obama moreso than what is really there. But like I started this paragraph- you may be right. But I am still not convinced that he is an egomaniac based on his "facial expressions and approach". I will watch more closely...

#3- I wish you would have expanded on it so I could better see what you see. Again, I think you are projecting this onto him and this is subjective...

There was some verbage in your last paragraph that scared me a little- "facist mania", "terrifying", "cult worship". But looking past the imagery these words evoke for me- I guess I can see where you are coming from. You see someone whom you do not like. You do not want him in office. And it worries you that his message has resonated with the masses and that he has such great momentum...

Your turn...

[Geo]

Geowickey, I agreed very much with your earlier observations. I missed the remark about the Edwards link. You are watching CNN?

I was earlier. Anderson Cooper said he received the "Hillary's last answer was almost verbatim what Edwards said" from Obama's people...

[rapunzel]

Geowicky and I are capable of our own conversation. Why are you acting like it's a crime that I don't like Obama? Last I check this was a Democracy. I don't know who "raven" is, but there's more than one person out there who might disagree with you.

Whether or not you like Sen. Obama makes no difference to me.

I do think that your statement claiming, "I was very impressed with Hillary. Never liked her much before, but she's extremely intelligent and has thought out and made efforts on her positions," was disingenuous. You have demonstrated over and over again your zeal for Sen. Clinton. And you've trashed Sen. Obama time and again. I just thought that perhaps geowickey should be aware that you were not....objective.

Anyone who pays any attention to linguistics at all knows that BIGDOG and raven are the same person.

I just hate to see a poster who wants to have a dialog about politics and issues get beaten over the head with your opinions without some idea of where you are coming from...

If you'd just tone down the anger and back up opinions with facts, we'd all get more out of these discussions. I don't mind divergent opinions, but I do mind nasty attacks.

[wrobert]

Anyone who pays any attention to linguistics at all knows that BIGDOG and raven are the same person.

I just hate to see a poster who wants to have a dialog about politics and issues get beaten over the head with your opinions without some idea of where you are coming from...

If you'd just tone down the anger and back up opinions with facts, we'd all get more out of these discussions. I don't mind divergent opinions, but I do mind nasty attacks.


I don't know. I sort of like watching someone debate with themselves in a public forum. At least it reminds me that I am not the crazy one......yet.

[Geo]

Whether or not you like Sen. Obama makes no difference to me.

I do think that your statement claiming, "I was very impressed with Hillary. Never liked her much before, but she's extremely intelligent and has thought out and made efforts on her positions," was disingenuous. You have demonstrated over and over again your zeal for Sen. Clinton. And you've trashed Sen. Obama time and again. I just thought that perhaps geowickey should be aware that you were not....objective.

Anyone who pays any attention to linguistics at all knows that BIGDOG and raven are the same person.

I just hate to see a poster who wants to have a dialog about politics and issues get beaten over the head with your opinions without some idea of where you are coming from...

If you'd just tone down the anger and back up opinions with facts, we'd all get more out of these discussions. I don't mind divergent opinions, but I do mind nasty attacks.

I have read many memorable posts by BIGDOG and I presume I have read Raven's as well but none come to mind...

I am intrigued that you believe they are one in the same. And I can't help but ponder how blown away I would be *if* you were right. Very impressive. But I guess we will never know for sure...

If I was to start investing time trying to crack such codes I think I would like to know most who is the wizard behind the curtain called SHELLY!

:lol:

[Geo]

I say this in fun and only because I cannot resist an opportunity to quote lines from Caddyshack-

For WaltonGOP-

At least it reminds me that I am not the crazy one......yet.

"Don't sell yourself short Judge, you're quite the slouch."

:clap:

[Ocean Lover]

I have read many memorable posts by BIGDOG and I presume I have read Raven's as well but none come to mind...

I am intrigued that you believe they are one in the same. And I can't help but ponder how blown away I would be *if* you were right. Very impressive. But I guess we will never know for sure...

If I was to start investing time trying to crack such codes I think I would like to know most who is the wizard behind the curtain called SHELLY!

:lol:

Good luck with that.;-)

I DVR'd the debate, watched AI and then Survivor. A girls gotta keep her priorities straight.:biggrin:

[wrobert]

I say this in fun and only because I cannot resist an opportunity to quote lines from Caddyshack-

For WaltonGOP-



"Don't sell yourself short Judge, you're quite the slouch."




Maybe I am just a better googler.

Ty Webb (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000331/): Don't sell yourself short Judge, you're a tremendous slouch.
:floor:

[Geo]

Maybe I am just a better googler.

Ty Webb (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000331/): Don't sell yourself short Judge, you're a tremendous slouch.
:floor:

:clap::clap::clap:

I went from memory (or apparently lack thereof) but kudos to you on a tremendous response and thx for being a good sport!!!

[I Am Woman]

Let's face it, Friends. We need a Clinton/Obama ticket to straighten out this fiscal and warring mess this great nation has been pulled into by The Shrub and his cronies/masters. Hopefully--just HOPEFULLY--it is not too late and that our grandchildren will not have to pay too heavy a price.

[wrobert]

Let's face it, Friends. We need a Clinton/Obama ticket to straighten out this fiscal and warring mess this great nation has been pulled into by The Shrub and his cronies/masters. Hopefully--just HOPEFULLY--it is not too late and that our grandchildren will not have to pay too heavy a price.


And another person jumps in from seemingly nowhere.

[rapunzel]

I can relate to/understand your rationale (but don't necessarily agree) with your Point #1. I threw out the word you started with ("plagarized") but you present a reasonable argument that if Obama said that they "swap" ideas that this would be valid only if Deval was using Obama's words/ideas as well and from what you are saying- this is not the case. Good point. But does this make him an egomaniac? I'm not convinced based on this...

The "just words" section of the speech was ad-libbed, not a written part of the speech from the teleprompter. He ad-libbed, as he often does, when he wants to drive a point home. It's one of the things that makes him a good speaker, the interaction with the audience. Unfortunately, at that moment, he chose to ad-lib based on a conversation he'd had with David Axelrod earlier in the day. David Axelrod is the guy who generated the "just words" message. He worked for Deval Patrick, and now he works for Barack Obama. He helps shape the candidate's message, and he is the source of the "just words" language.

It rings true to me that these three men have conversations and words and phrases bounce around and get picked up. It was an accidental repeat of a message, but I'd bet anything Sen. Obama was unaware Deval Patrick had used the same line in a speech.


I have read many memorable posts by BIGDOG and I presume I have read Raven's as well but none come to mind...


I'm sorry to have jumped in...I didn't realize you were familiar with BIGDOG.

As for the BIGDOG/raven thing...I promise I am not omnipotent...I just picked up on the same tone, misspellings, and grammar quirks because I always seem to draw a quick and tart response and it's definitely the same voice.

[I Am Woman]

Don't call me "Beach Tourist" please. I live, I pray, I vote, I volunteer, and I kick arse here in Santa Rosa Beach. A tourist I am not!
I am woman; hear me roar!

[rapunzel]

I was earlier. Anderson Cooper said he received the "Hillary's last answer was almost verbatim what Edwards said" from Obama's people...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zAYItnI-lPo&eurl=http://www.dailykos.com/

The best line of the night....

[Geo]

The "just words" section of the speech was ad-libbed, not a written part of the speech from the teleprompter. He ad-libbed, as he often does, when he wants to drive a point home. It's one of the things that makes him a good speaker, the interaction with the audience. Unfortunately, at that moment, he chose to ad-lib based on a conversation he'd had with David Axelrod earlier in the day. David Axelrod is the guy who generated the "just words" message. He worked for Deval Patrick, and now he works for Barack Obama. He helps shape the candidate's message, and he is the source of the "just words" language.

It rings true to me that these three men have conversations and words and phrases bounce around and get picked up. It was an accidental repeat of a message, but I'd bet anything Sen. Obama was unaware Deval Patrick had used the same line in a speech.


I agree based on what little I know...



I'm sorry to have jumped in...I didn't realize you were familiar with BIGDOG.

As for the BIGDOG/raven thing...I promise I am not omnipotent...I just picked up on the same tone, misspellings, and grammar quirks because I always seem to draw a quick and tart response and it's definitely the same voice.

Rapunzel, I know you were just looking out for me. And like I said, i was intrigued by your theory and share your interest in communication. I only hope that you and BIGDOG can get back to enlightening and entertaining debate sometime soon and that no permanent damage has been done as a result of your latest exchange.

Cheers...

[rapunzel]

Don't call me "Beach Tourist" please. I live, I pray, I vote, I volunteer, and I kick arse here in Santa Rosa Beach. A tourist I am not!
I am woman; hear me roar!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aUfDxRelPHg&feature=related

[Geo]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zAYItnI-lPo&eurl=http://www.dailykos.com/



:eek: WOW!

It will be interesting to see how this turns out!!!

Does Obama call her on this (above and beyond the media doing it for him)? And if so, does it work or does it give her solid (despite being "borrowed") answer even more airplay?

I'm fascinated with the dynamics here!

[up4golf]

i thought the part at the end of the debate about being honored to be up there with obama was the begining of hillary's concession of the nomination to him.

[Geo]

Okay, BIGDOG...

CNN is reairing the debate so I am seeing the earlier parts I missed before. I totally get why you said this-

WOW. Talk about XEROX Obama. They should never ask Hilary questions first. Obama wouldn't know what to say.


In particular- for questions on Immigration (e.g. continuing the building of the fence, whether or not a bilingual nation is a problem, etc.), Hillary went first and then Obama mostly just echoed what she said. I'll give you that...

But I don't think this is because he lacks original ideas but rather I think they genuinely agree (they are from the same party) on sound ideas surrounding these issues... IMHO

G

[rapunzel]

:eek: WOW!

It will be interesting to see how this turns out!!!

Does Obama call her on this (above and beyond the media doing it for him)? And if so, does it work or does it give her solid (despite being "borrowed") answer even more airplay?

I'm fascinated with the dynamics here!

Now I'm intrigued. Great questions.

Does it hurt her more, since she's "borrowing" from a former opponent rather than a friend?

Does it make her attacks look more calculated?

Will she admit that sometimes a good turn of phrase will stick in your head, and you may inadvertently come out with the same words without realizing that they are not your own?

[Geo]

Now I'm intrigued. Great questions.

Does it hurt her more, since she's "borrowing" from a former opponent rather than a friend?

Does it make her attacks look more calculated?

Will she admit that sometimes a good turn of phrase will stick in your head, and you may inadvertently come out with the same words without realizing that they are not your own?

Now that i saw the video I think that her best answer of the night (and IMHO- the only one that could have made a difference in these next critical states) is the very one that will absolutely put the nail in the coffin for her (presuming Obama and the media call her on it)...

And sadly, it's her own fault because if she hadn't started the whole plagarism issue it would not have mattered at all that her words mirrored Edwards's.

[Geo]

I keep coming back to BIGDOG to give him some props...

Earlier I said I had a hard time with some of the rationale behind why you say Obama is an egomaniac. But I just caught a soundbyte that I feel supports your argument (not that I agree with it)...

And I quote-

"What I’ve been talking about in these speeches, and I gotta admit, some of ‘em are pretty good..." -Obama during his answer to the plagarism question

Of course he was kidding and I get that. But the problem is that the speeches *were* good so it comes off badly, perhaps egomaniacal, to someone who hasn't decided that they like him yet...

It's kinda like a really good looking person calling themselves "good looking". Drew Carey can pull it off. Cindy Crawford cannot...

[Here4Good]

BigDog got banned for calling Obama an egomaniac? I hope there was more to it than that.....

[kurt]

BigDog got banned for calling Obama an egomaniac? I hope there was more to it than that.....

I had to delete some of her posts over the last few days, including a couple on this thread.

[Tootsie]

I watched most of the debate (missed the last few minutes), and I thought both obama and clinton were excellent. some points:

1. for the first half they were so kind and respectful to one another it appeared that they were two outstanding people on the same team. (in a way they are).

2. hillary floundered pretty badly at one point, after her attempt to insult obama about "plagerism", crowd booed and hissed, obama was unruffled and responded in a very direct way that the people want to hear about issues, and that this was the "silly season in politics". hillary lost her composure with a really rambling response for about a minute.

3. they each responded with very similair answers regardless of who answered first. but they also threw in their own unique twist or ideas.

4. obama scored big time in his pointing out his voting on the war (once again) and his consistency.

5 they both avoided directly answering certain questions, and did it very well. which is something one must know how to do as a politician.:roll:

6. health care scares me on both of their answers to this question. it just does.

7. education - obama has my vote on this issue alone.

8. immigration - I LOVED madeline albright's take on this in her speech yesterday (heard part of it on npr), and hillary echoed the same thoughts in the debate.

9. Obama - egomaniac? perhaps. you kind of need to have a healthy ego to put yourself out there like that. so I think its more self-confidence in one's ability. but he is very sincere, authentic, and believes. when he said some of his speeches were really good - we just rolled:rofl:. this guys is funny on top of brilliant. I can't think of a better combo.

10. Hillary - I can't help liking her. always have. and I wish like hell I could vote for her. but she is status quo and she is divisive. maybe status quo feels safer for many. but not me. I feel status quo and divisive language/action combine to form america's worst enemy.

11. McCain is a nice guy but reminds me of a reptile and his wife is scarey looking.:rolling: had to throw that in.





Don't call me "Beach Tourist" please. I live, I pray, I vote, I volunteer, and I kick arse here in Santa Rosa Beach. A tourist I am not!
I am woman; hear me roar!

:welcome: roaring woman. we can't see where you are from, your profile is incomplete. also, you are a beach tourist due to the number of posts you have on this board, so deal with it, and post often... ;-):lol::wave:

[Here4Good]

I had to delete some of her posts over the last few days, including a couple on this thread.


Ah. Hate it when that happens....

[Tootsie]

BigDog got banned for calling Obama an egomaniac? I hope there was more to it than that.....

there is nothing wrong with disagreement and heating things up. but repeated nastiness is not acceptable when people are trying to have a thoughtful discussion, imo. this is not a democracy. it's a message board.

my ignore button works pretty well until you guys start quoting the ignored party and I have to see them anyway.:roll::lol: oh well.

[tistheseason]

I agree with Obama when he said that this is where the silliness of politics comes in -- in reference to the "plagerism" attack. I'm am constantly saying things to my kids that I realize (after they come our of my mouth) are direct quotes from my mom. OR I'll say a line from a movie to my husband. These are the influences of my life. How do you avoid NOT quoting them? Obama should be free to quote his advisors and people that have inspired or influenced him as well.

And really I think Hillary should be free to do the same.

It seems so petty to even be discussing it. I was really dissappointed (but not surprised) by Hillary's "xerox" comment. I do think it's ironic that her greatest line (although it was her delivery method that was great -- as she seemed "real") was copied from Edwards. But I hope the media will let it die. Do people really care?

[wrobert]

It's kinda like a really good looking person calling themselves "good looking". Drew Carey can pull it off. Cindy Crawford cannot...



Drew wears glasses.

Cindy does not.

[tistheseason]

Did anyone see on CNN when one of the Analyst were talking about seeing Clinton and Obama before the debate? They said Obama greeted Clinton Warmly and put his arm around her. She responded kindly. Then they joked about how tall their secret service people were. And how the secret service bought boots in their time off. I would love to have been a fly on the wall and to have seen this warm albeit trivial exchange.

[Allifunn]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zAYItnI-lPo&eurl=http://www.dailykos.com/

The best line of the night....
:roll:

Wish I could have been there with you Punzy! :biggrin:

[Miss Kitty]

BigDog got banned for calling Obama an egomaniac? I hope there was more to it than that.....


Me, too! I actually thought this thread started by geowickey had some good discussion. can someone explain to me the rules for political discussion? i see people using facts, "facts" and personal opinion. inquiring minds want to know! sorry, i'll go back to lurking now...this is a tough crowd!

[hnooe]

Ah. Hate it when that happens....

I certainly do as well. I know it gets very comfy and cozy for "the family " of those commentators and posters on Sowal who seem to have the most amount of posts. This group, including myself, also have the most amount of concern and interest I feel--the two do go hand in hand.

I think there is respect for other people's opinions here in general here, I certainly hope banning is not done arbitrarily or by the consensus of a small coterie! :angry: I don't know how is works here?

[krafty]

9. Obama - egomaniac? perhaps. you kind of need to have a healthy ego to put yourself out there like that. so I think its more self-confidence in one's ability. but he is very sincere, authentic, and believes. when he said some of his speeches were really good - we just rolled:rofl:. this guys is funny on top of brilliant. I can't think of a better combo.

I liked your analysis of the debate, with exception to #9 (and#11;-)). I am bothered with "sincere and authentic" when discussing politicians. To me, those are attributes that need time to be assesed and in Obama's case, I have not had enough time to determine that. I'm not saying that he's not sincere, I'm just saying it's too soon for me to judge. I agree with you that a candidate needs a healthy ego, but I also think great leaders need to have an equal amount of humility. I think is IS possible. He is a fantastic orator, but he sometimes goes past the point that I want to listen. I thought 47 minutes on Tuesday night was excessive.

ND went huge for Obama so now for us it's just a waiting game for the dem choice. My next vote will be for McCain or (most likely) Obama. For now I continue to be decidedly undecided. :confused:

[Furthur]

Why was BIGDOG banned?
I think we are all intelligent enough to use our own filter.

[kurt]

I certainly do as well. I know it gets very comfy and cozy for "the family " of those commentators and posters on Sowal who seem to have the most amount of posts. This group, including myself, also have the most amount of concern and interest I feel--the two do go hand in hand.

I think there is respect for other people's opinions here in general here, I certainly hope banning is not done arbitrarily or by the consensus of a small coterie! :angry: I don't know how is works here?

You certainly do what? Hate when I have to delete posts, or when people post stuff that has to be deleted (which I believe is what here4good meant)? Only a few people have been banned over several years, only after given plenty of leeway. A couple of people have returned, repeated offenses and been banned again.

Personal attacks are not allowed on this board.

[Here4Good]

Yes, that was what I meant :D.

I hate it when the moderator has to delete posts which go over the edge to personal attacks.

[scooterbug44]

Whether or not a candidate is speaking their own words or copying someone else is very low on my priority list as I know thay all have speechwriters and consultants telling them how and what to say.

Obviously they should give credit where credit is due, but much bigger issues should take precedence IMO.

[Geo]

You certainly do what? Hate when I have to delete posts, or when people post stuff that has to be deleted (which I believe is what here4good meant)? Only a few people have been banned over several years, only after given plenty of leeway. A couple of people have returned, repeated offenses and been banned again.

Personal attacks are not allowed on this board.

I missed the personal attacks that IMHO would have warranted the ban-Is this because they were deleted before I read them or because maybe they weren't that bad?

BIGDOG was a little over the top in some of the posts that I saw but I went out of my way to filter through the BS and get to the heart of his/her points. I attempted to salvage a healthy argument- even adding credence to some of his/her arguments...

And I was looking forward to his/her response to my last posts that addressed him/her...

Too bad...

I enjoyed the discussion from others as well. Good stuff.

Kurt, it has been a while since this was said-

thanks for having the vision to create such a great medium...

:clap:

[Tootsie]

I agree with Obama when he said that this is where the silliness of politics comes in -- in reference to the "plagerism" attack. I'm am constantly saying things to my kids that I realize (after they come our of my mouth) are direct quotes from my mom. OR I'll say a line from a movie to my husband. These are the influences of my life. How do you avoid NOT quoting them? Obama should be free to quote his advisors and people that have inspired or influenced him as well.

And really I think Hillary should be free to do the same.

It seems so petty to even be discussing it. I was really dissappointed (but not surprised) by Hillary's "xerox" comment. I do think it's ironic that her greatest line (although it was her delivery method that was great -- as she seemed "real") was copied from Edwards. But I hope the media will let it die. Do people really care?
excellent post tis.

obama's comments on the "silly season in politics" was one of those truly inspirational yet funny comments, to me.

Me, too! I actually thought this thread started by geowickey had some good discussion. can someone explain to me the rules for political discussion? i see people using facts, "facts" and personal opinion. inquiring minds want to know! sorry, i'll go back to lurking now...this is a tough crowd!

Rules for political discussion? don't think we have anything in writing. mainly listen, learn, speak, state your opinion, be respectful when disagreeing with another's opinion, use common courtesy towards others. you don't have to use common courtesy to candidates however - they are not board members.:lol: sometimes we do see someone coming onto a very thoughtful thread, and they google/cut/paste some random extreme article or blog just for inflammatory purposes. we should be like obama and just move beyond such silliness and continue with the conversation as if it never happened. Mostly, we are all learning the conversation of politics as we go. good for us.

oh, and President bashing is considered healthy and patriotic as hail. at least by some. not me of course.;-)

MK - what do you mean this is a tough group? this thread is a very nice discussion, except for one person - it's not what was said, its how its said and its after multiple bannings. she keeps reincarnating but never for the better.

[wrobert]

Why was BIGDOG banned?
I think we are all intelligent enough to use our own filter.


Of course Kurt is in charge of this thing, but usually questioning the moderator, in a public forum, is another quick way to lose your posting privileges.

[Geo]

I think there is educational/practical value in understanding why one was/can be banned. I don't think further crossed a line in asking.

2 cents...

If you never hear from me again you will know that WaltonGOP was right when (s)he said-

Of course Kurt is in charge of this thing, but usually questioning the moderator, in a public forum, is another quick way to lose your posting privileges.

[scooterbug44]

One of the great things about Sowal is the wide range of opinions and topics that are discussed in a fun, offbeat, and informative manner.

People like raven take all the funn out of it and won't stay banned.

Kurt is very fair!

[Tootsie]

I think there is educational/practical value in understanding why one was/can be banned. I don't think further crossed a line in asking.

2 cents...

If you never hear from me again you will know that WaltonGOP was right when (s)he said-


:clap::lolabove::lol:don't worry, geowicky, we'll come looking for you.

[Geo]

:clap::lolabove::lol:don't worry, geowicky, we'll come looking for you.

I'll just follow BIGDOG's lead and reincarnate as geowaven

:rolling:

[InletBchDweller]

I am curious to know if there is/was proof that BIGDOG was Raven?? I like some others did not see anything that warrented a ban, maybe that is why it was deleted so fast. :idontno:Personal attacks to another member of the board is bad but if they post what they think about someone/something I dont think they should be banned. I can see how some of his/her posts would have made some people upset/mad/cross but I was once never offended....:wave:

Oh well, back to the games/discussions :clap:

[rapunzel]

God, where is 30-Amen? I miss him and his cute little avatar.

The unstated rule on political posting -- IMHO -- is that you be intellectually honest and somewhat respectful. To plagiarize -- we can disagree without being disagreeable.

The things that are not okay are personal attacks, drive by posting with snarky, Ann Coulter inspired non sequiturs, or copying and pasting talking points.

The reason I hope people do these things isn't because it hurts my feelings, it's because it kills the thread. The thread goes off topic into snarky back and forth, or it frustrates the crap out of everyone trying to have a legitimate discussion.

I dabble in a couple of political message boards, but this it the only one I enjoy -- it's not an echo chamber with everyone spouting the same point of view, and it's not too esoteric. It's approachable, and relevant.

Of course, about a year ago it was not so much fun.

[wrobert]

board is bad but if they post what they think about someone/something I dont think they should be banned. I can see how some of his/her posts would have made some people upset/mad/cross but I was once never offended....:wave:

Oh well, back to the games/discussions :clap:

But you are not a Democrat.

[InletBchDweller]

But you are not a Democrat.

:lol::lol:That is exactly what my husband said:lol::lol:

[Miss Kitty]

I am impressed by the posters that caught it if the raven/BigDog connection is correct. I have to laugh and say that it was my experience that BigDog's posts were WAY easier for me to follow than raven's.

[JustaLocal]

I am impressed by the posters that caught it if the raven/BigDog connection is correct. I have to laugh and say that it was my experience that BigDog's posts were WAY easier for me to follow than raven's.

Me too.

[InletBchDweller]

me three...

[jdarg]

Go back and read all posts by BigDog. Many posts on several threads were combative in tone and looking to pick a fight. It's not like this thread was the first. I was starting to cringe everytime I saw a new comment from this person- and it was only going to escalate.

Kudos to Kurt for nippin' it in the bud, as Barney says. We have had enough flaming lately.

And WaltonGOP, I hold you to a higher bar than I probably should, but your comment was exactly what Christi was talking about in her post- a drive-by snark. I like your intelligent, knowledgeable posts must better.

[wrobert]

Go back and read all posts by BigDog. Many posts on several threads were combative in tone and looking to pick a fight. It's not like this thread was the first. I was starting to cringe everytime I saw a new comment from this person- and it was only going to escalate.

Kudos to Kurt for nippin' it in the bud, as Barney says. We have had enough flaming lately.

And WaltonGOP, I hold you to a higher bar than I probably should, but your comment was exactly what Christi was talking about in her post- a drive-by snark. I like your intelligent, knowledgeable posts must better.

Come on. This forum is getting boring. Someone has to do something every once in a while to stir things up.:idontno:

[Furthur]

So BigDog made a personal attack against another member?
I missed that and agree that is offensive.
Just wanted to be sure the ban wasn't for a political opinion.

BTW, Just what is Snarky?

[kurt]

Yes that is correct. Opinions can be freely shared without fear of censorship. This particular member had been banned previously for attacks. I allowed her back against my better judgement and it happened again.

One of the few rules we have is no personal attacks.