Should we read our kids' text messages?

[bluemtnrunner]

This is being debated by the teenagers on Facebook. I wanted to send it out here and see what this older and just as opinionated crowd thinks.

In my house the rule is no phones after 10pm. My 18 year old daughter was on the phone after midnight on a school night and I took her cell phone away. At 4:45a.m. the cell alarm clock went off. An hour or so later the text messages started rolling in. Concerned that my kid is more into texting than finishing school, I read her messagesthat were coming in so early. Concerned by the first words of the other messages that I could see, I opened them. I then responded to two of the messages. One to her boyfriend and one to a friend of hers. (let's just say right here and now that I do not like the boyfriend).

The boyfriend fired back "talk about invasion of privacy." I won't bring you into all of the drama that ensued. But I do want to give you his take on this as posted on Facebook:

"where should we draw the line on text messages and privacy? well an obvious is: if its not your phone, its not your business. but what about parents? Parents pay the bill for their childrens phones. does that entitle them to search their childrens texts? it would most likely. but I see a problem. what about their friends? If lets say, a person's daughter has text messaging; if the parents read text messages (good or bad) you had sent their daughter, is that right? here is my idea. I believe the parents should be able to view sent text messages, but they should not be able to read recieved text messages and here is why I say that. it is their daughter, they pay the bill, and it is their phone, they should be able to see what she is saying. but they don't own her friends phone's, they may not know her friends.

I recieved a text message from a friends phone and it was her mother. she made a comment to me about a message I had sent her daughter. I felt raped. to me, that was just as bad as digging through my garbage to steal my identity, or opening letters I had sent her daughter.

what do you think? an invasion of privacy or are parents truly on firm ground?

some might say, " well if you don't send anything bad, you have nothing to worry about," and you are true. but what if innocent information is taken the wrong way by the parents? for example...

Text 1 : my brother is having a friend in town

Text 2 : thats ok I guess, I dnt know if we will every get any time alone.

Text 1 : don't worry, we will have enough privacy.

what do you all make of the conversation? it could be taken in a good way or a bad way. but what if all the parents see is, " Don't worry, we will have enough privacy."? what do you think the parents will think? they would freek right? so was this an invasion of privacy?"


My response to this was that there were other things going on which led me to look at the text messages. And there were other text messages which led me, as a parent, to be very concerned for my daughter's well being. Especially given the history of the boy's relationship with my daughter, myself and my fiance.

[ShallowsNole]

Yes.

But be prepared to temper any discussions on what you might find with love.

[bluemtnrunner]

Yes.

But be prepared to temper any discussions on what you might find with love.

Instead of meeting anything that I find about love with temper?:idontno:

No, seriously, that is good advice and I hope that I have done that where my kid is concerned (not so much for the boy).

[Kase626]

I think that's a touchy subject. I know I would feel extremely violated if my parents read my text messages...but I'm not too worried. They can't even answer their cell phones without asking for help. My parents are a bit technically challenged.

But seriously, reading text messages is almost like listening in on phone calls, reading a diary, or eavesdropping. It's an invasion of privacy, however small. If you are worried about your child's well-being, you should ask them about it. If something is bothering them, they will probably tell you.

On the other hand, however, I can see why a parent would want to take a peek into their child's "private" life. If you're worried about the well being of your child, if there is valid concern for your child's safety or the safety of others, then by all means, snoop. But give your child the benefit of the doubt. Talk to them first, give them a chance to speak up before you go looking for evidence.

[Beach Angel]

what about a phone/cell service that doesn't include text messaging? having taught high school for 30 years, i've seen about everything. if your gut tells you there s a problem, there likely is one. text messaging and im and even cell phones are unnecessary most of the time - whatever did we do as teenagers when no one was available 24/7? text messaging is especially distracting, and is nothing more than electronic note passing. my kid took a cell phone when going out on an errand or on the weekend, but did not carry one all of the time - and certainly not in his room or at school! you are on firm ground here, i think.

[Johnrudy]

I feel your pain. Here's a similar thread I started before you joined the board I believe. Maybe it will help a bit. It's tough. Good luck.

Invasion of privacy ? (http://www.sowal.com/bb/showthread.php?t=16623&highlight=Invasion+privacy)

[tistheseason]

My kids are little. . . so I haven't crossed this bridge yet. But I assure you I will be reading these things. Not continuously, but regularly. I would tell them when I handed the phone to them, or gave them a computer, or handed them car keys that these things are MINE. And they can BORROW them, but I have full access. I wouldn't be appologetic about it at all.

To the boys point, if there is something that could be taken out of context, than I would certainly give him the chance to explain himself before I jumped to conclusions. But I would urge them not to send messages that could be misleading. That is the root of the problem, IMO. Not that you read it.

[bluemtnrunner]

My kids are little. . . so I haven't crossed this bridge yet. But I assure you I will be reading these things. Not continuously, but regularly. I would tell them when I handed the phone to them, or gave them a computer, or handed them car keys that these things are MINE. And they can BORROW them, but I have full access. I wouldn't be appologetic about it at all.


I have told all three of my kids that I have full access and that I won't use it unless I have reason for concern. When they were little I thought I would be so cool when they were older. My kids and I do talk a lot, actual conversations in which opinions are respected even if not agreed to.


Two things that I find interesting 1) My daughter is not upset that I read her messages or that I sent the boy a text. She is upset that all of this is happening but we have talked about it and she seems to understand my point of view. She has not accused me of invading her privacy. She isn't stamping her feet, but he certainly is.

2) The boy says that it is ok for parents to read what their own kids send out, but not what they receive. So I am only invading his privacy and not hers.

[sowalgayboi]

I don't think this is an invasion of privacy at all. Unless said child is working their own job and paying said phone bill get over it. Even then I feel that a parent has a right and sometimes a duty to monitor their childs communication.

As for what this boy is saying, I really hope you daughter finds someone better. The fact that he is taking this sort of attitude with his girlfriends mother shows that he clearly has no respect for you or her. Let her know that I vote for new boyfriend.

[NoHall]

This is being debated by the teenagers on Facebook. I wanted to send it out here and see what this older and just as opinionated crowd thinks.

In my house the rule is no phones after 10pm. My 18 year old daughter was on the phone after midnight on a school night and I took her cell phone away. At 4:45a.m. the cell alarm clock went off. An hour or so later the text messages started rolling in. Concerned that my kid is more into texting than finishing school, I read her messagesthat were coming in so early. Concerned by the first words of the other messages that I could see, I opened them. I then responded to two of the messages. One to her boyfriend and one to a friend of hers. (let's just say right here and now that I do not like the boyfriend).

The boyfriend fired back "talk about invasion of privacy." I won't bring you into all of the drama that ensued. But I do want to give you his take on this as posted on Facebook:

"where should we draw the line on text messages and privacy? well an obvious is: if its not your phone, its not your business. but what about parents? Parents pay the bill for their childrens phones. does that entitle them to search their childrens texts? it would most likely. but I see a problem. what about their friends? If lets say, a person's daughter has text messaging; if the parents read text messages (good or bad) you had sent their daughter, is that right? here is my idea. I believe the parents should be able to view sent text messages, but they should not be able to read recieved text messages and here is why I say that. it is their daughter, they pay the bill, and it is their phone, they should be able to see what she is saying. but they don't own her friends phone's, they may not know her friends.

I recieved a text message from a friends phone and it was her mother. she made a comment to me about a message I had sent her daughter. I felt raped. to me, that was just as bad as digging through my garbage to steal my identity, or opening letters I had sent her daughter.

what do you think? an invasion of privacy or are parents truly on firm ground?

some might say, " well if you don't send anything bad, you have nothing to worry about," and you are true. but what if innocent information is taken the wrong way by the parents? for example...

Text 1 : my brother is having a friend in town

Text 2 : thats ok I guess, I dnt know if we will every get any time alone.

Text 1 : don't worry, we will have enough privacy.

what do you all make of the conversation? it could be taken in a good way or a bad way. but what if all the parents see is, " Don't worry, we will have enough privacy."? what do you think the parents will think? they would freek right? so was this an invasion of privacy?"


My response to this was that there were other things going on which led me to look at the text messages. And there were other text messages which led me, as a parent, to be very concerned for my daughter's well being. Especially given the history of the boy's relationship with my daughter, myself and my fiance.

That boy needs to learn one simple rule that dates back to the dawn of written communication: If you don't want it to be read by the whole world, don't write it down. This is no different than parents finding notes written in class back before cell phones. Never mind the invasion of privacy--if he doesn't want to feel "raped" (puh-LEEZE! what a drama queen!) then he should whisper it in your daughter's ear.

Dear Kase has a great point about talking to kids, but it doesn't seem that you were out to invade anyone's privacy. If my kid's (assuming I had a kid) cell phone went off at 5:45 a.m., I would have had an absolute field day with it...

You set the boundaries with your child, and her boyfriend crossed them. Consequences are a natural part of the process. Or maybe I've already worked at a military school too long! :lol:

[bluemtnrunner]

I feel your pain. Here's a similar thread I started before you joined the board I believe. Maybe it will help a bit. It's tough. Good luck.

Invasion of privacy ? (http://www.sowal.com/bb/showthread.php?t=16623&highlight=Invasion+privacy)


I read the old thread...Oh my goodness, I'm guilty of restarting a potential firestorm. MY contrived drama is giving ME a headache.
No really, I'm glad to see that there was so much discussion then and now.


I am actually very interested in seeing how the thread here and the one on facebook compare.

[bluemtnrunner]

As for what this boy is saying, I really hope you daughter finds someone better. The fact that he is taking this sort of attitude with his girlfriends mother shows that he clearly has no respect for you or her. Let her know that I vote for new boyfriend.




All in favor of a new boyfriend say AYE :banned:

[sowalgayboi]

:banned:


All in favor of a new boyfriend say AYE

AYE

I'm confused by that banned smiley, is that the boyfriend or me?

[NoHall]

I read the thread...Oh my goodness, I'm guilty of restarting a potential firestorm. MY contrived drama is giving ME a headache.


I am actually very interested in seeing how the thread here and the one on facebook compare.

I think it's a good thing to keep talking about, though. With kids it's so easy to set up an "us vs. them" mentality on both sides. I know that I'm constantly having to remind my students that I'm not the enemy--my sole function is to further them along in their lives. I think it's even harder with parents and children. (Duh--I work at a boarding school! Lots of these kids and parents have no idea how to function together!)

The cool part about your story is what you said about your daughter a couple of posts up--that she isn't stamping her feet over it. She sounds like a level-headed girl. My guess is that if you keep the lines of communication open between the two of you, it will pan out in the end.

[bluemtnrunner]

AYE

I'm confused by that banned smiley, is that the boyfriend or me?


All fixed...sorry for the confusion.

[Johnrudy]

I read the old thread...Oh my goodness, I'm guilty of restarting a potential firestorm. MY contrived drama is giving ME a headache.
No really, I'm glad to see that there was so much discussion then and now.


I am actually very interested in seeing how the thread here and the one on facebook compare.
in the end you know what you're doing is correct, you just need a bit of confirmation in the midst of the confusion.

And fwiw, my son and this current girlfriend are slowly breaking up - all's well that ends well. Then it starts all over again! :lol:

[bluemtnrunner]

As it turns out, after reading all of yesterday's texts and today's events (there were emails to me from the boy), my daughter is not speaking to him. She, the other kid I texted and her best friend are a bit stunned by this guy's behavior. She isn't ready to breakup with him but she is definitely seeing him through different eyes.
Luckily he lives four hours away so he can't swoop in and woo her, she has some time to process all of this.
Maybe I did do the right thing afterall.


Johnrudy, where is that teenage son of yours, maybe we divert them both!:blink:

[iwishiwasthere]

Hang in there!! Unfortunately no certain rules to parenting. Do what you think is right and be willing to change or bend if it was a mistake. Humbleness goes a long way in a relationship. Most of all let keep talking and let them know you care and love them...without preaching. Sounds like you are well on your way.:clap:

As for the after hours texts, the rules were broken and that was the consequences. That is life. Children have to learn (as adults know) that for every action there will be a reaction. She sounds like a good kid so give keep believing in her.

[scooterbug44]

My parents' position was that they trusted you until something happened to betray that trust and then it was Gestapo time. They were big fans of "you're a kid, you have no rights" and "privileges must be earned". If they confiscated my phone and it rang at 5 am, all hell would have broken lose - even without the message content being of concern.

I wouldn't have responded to those early AM texts, but agree with everything else you've done. Boyfriend sounds like scum.

[livingiSoWal]

Yes, i think my girlfriends mom would beat me if I responded to her like that. Put the fear in him. My girl friends mom is only 5'3'' and I am afraid of her. I can't give my .02 on ready the texts though because I do not have kids, and my parents never did it to me.

[aleonard]

I think the young man gives up any right to privacy when he calls a phone registered in your name. The fact that it's an incoming call or text and not outgoing doesn't hold water in the argument of privacy. Just MHO :wave:

[yucarenow]

maybe at 14.......but if my parents had started rummaging through my things when i was 18..that would have been the end of my trust in them...sure its YOUR cell phone...but you let THEM use it.......take away their text messaging or phone service if they abuse your rules, but don't create an issue of trust by snooping around like they've just committed a felony

give the kids a break...already have to deal with so much nowadays...harder tests.....harder to get into colleges....and every other thing that past generations had to deal with........the world is getting tougher and tougher.......let em breathe

that's just my young-minded .02 :)

[hnooe]

Why not read kid's texts, President Bush has authorized their parent's phones to be tapped without permission......today, it just seems to be more acceptible, on all fronts.

[olive]

I'm with sowalgayboi....that boyfriend's gotta go!:bang:

If he acts this way to you, I shudder to think how he acts toward your daughter!!!

Your actions were totally justified.

[raven]

to some extent we're always going to be "them" to our kids and that's how kids are able to test boundaries and assert their dominance. they don't want us to be cool, because they'll never think we are...that's our midlife weirdness.

that said, kids don't need 24 hr access to outside communication, especially during sleeping hours be it phones, computers or text. and if they're awake and communicating and living in my house, i have an obligation to know what's going on not because i'm trying to interfere, but becaue i'm going to protect them in the very limited way that i'm able to. i don't want to tell you what our friends found on their kid's phone, but it was enough to wake us up.

and bluemtnrunner...when that boy has children of his own then his opinion will be relevant, but i think he's impertinent to try to tell you what the rules are for YOUR CHILD! hate to think what HIS parents are like, but that's his problem. your daughter has a good parent.

[raven]

maybe at 14.......but if my parents had started rummaging through my things when i was 18..that would have been the end of my trust in them...sure its YOUR cell phone...but you let THEM use it.......take away their text messaging or phone service if they abuse your rules, but don't create an issue of trust by snooping around like they've just committed a felony

give the kids a break...already have to deal with so much nowadays...harder tests.....harder to get into colleges....and every other thing that past generations had to deal with........the world is getting tougher and tougher.......let em breathe

that's just my young-minded .02 :)

i know what you're saying 14 is a long way from 18. but, the phone gives people MORE access to your kids they wouldn't otherwise have. you know that for young people in relationships the constant texting to ask where someone is and who they're with is often the first indicator of an abusive relationship, the possessiveness of having to know where their girlfriend/boyfriend is at all times, so it's worth checking IF there are other signs even if they are older. sometimes it's not about trust, but about knowledge and guidance.

you know i like my research, so here you go:

(CBS) Teenage love can be exciting. But sometimes it can be more than puppy love and turn dangerous. A new article in Family Circle magazine tells parents some of the signs to look for in an unhealthy teen relationship, which may be more common than many people think.

The magazine found that 25 percent of teens are harassed or put down by a partner via their cell phone through verbal conversations or texting. The magazine also found that 71 percent of teens say their boyfriend or girlfriend spread negative rumors about them and 75 percent of parents didn't know their teens were physically hurt or bruised by a partner.

Anya Alvarez, 18, says that at 15 she was abused by two different boyfriends. She said the first relationship lasted only a month, but the emotional abuse began after two weeks. She wasn't allowed to go out with her friends or do the things she loved. He also started putting sexual pressure on her. Anya then entered into a second relationship — which also lasted a month — and the exact same thing happened. She never talked to her mother about it.

"She had no idea," Anya told The Early Show co-anchor Hannah Storm. I didn't tell her about the sexual abuse, how they tried to control me. I didn't see it as a problem. I thought, it happened, I'll get over it and move on. I didn't realize how it would affect relationships I had later."

Betty S. Wong, executive editor of Family Circle, said when teens enter into their first relationship, they don't know what is appropriate. Things like wanting to be with the other person at all times and jealously can easily be mistaken for love.

"Love really is blind in your first relationship," she said.

Wong said parents should pay attention to changes in their teen's behavior. If she changes the way she dresses, stops participating in family activities or her grades fall, it could be a sign that a boyfriend or partner is being controlling. Another big sign is cell phone or computer use.

"Technology creates accessibility," Wong said. "With cell phones and computers, kids are never out of touch anymore."

Wong said if parents find out their child is in an abusive relationship, they should control phone use to minimize further contact. Parents should also reach out to the school, and perhaps have the child's locker moved or pick her up earlier.

"Also," she said, "just be supportive."

If you are a teen in need of help or are a parent who suspects your child is in an abusive relationship, seek help here:

National Teen Dating Abuse Helpline (NTDAH)
866-331-9474
Loveisrespect.org (http://www.loveisrespect.org/)

Choose Respect
Chooserespect.org (http://www.chooserespect.org/)

National Domestic Violence Hotline
800-799-7233, ndvh.org (http://www.ndvh.org/)

Break the Cycle
888-988-8336
breakthecycle.org (http://www.breakthecycle.org/)
Legal advice, support, online communities and education for abused teens

Love Is Not Abuse
Loveisnotabuse.com (http://www.loveisnotabuse.com/)

[peapod1980]

I'm with sowalgayboi....that boyfriend's gotta go!:bang:

If he acts this way to you, I shudder to think how he acts toward your daughter!!!

Your actions were totally justified.
olive, :welcome:! You have officially joined the parent club. :clap:

[aleonard]

Why not read kid's texts, President Bush has authorized their parent's phones to be tapped without permission......today, it just seems to be more acceptible, on all fronts.

I was thinking that same thought when I wrote my short response.:lolabove:

[hnooe]

I was thinking that same thought when I wrote my short response.:lolabove:

I like you aleonard--heck, I like anybody that will put up with a Border Collie :bow:

[olive]

olive, :welcome:! You have officially joined the parent club. :clap:

Yep.:blush:

[aleonard]

I like you aleonard--heck, I like anybody that will put up with a Border Collie :bow:

Border Collie X2 :D Glad they put up with me. Thanks:wave:I've been doing research on privacy issues since 9/11 and even a little before for a new series coming out in March. I think the young man, if he did his research, would be surprised over just who, besides mom, is reading his text messages.;-)

[Johnrudy]

I like you aleonard--heck, I like anybody that will put up with a Border Collie :bow:

:wave:

[Kase626]

maybe at 14.......but if my parents had started rummaging through my things when i was 18..that would have been the end of my trust in them...sure its YOUR cell phone...but you let THEM use it.......take away their text messaging or phone service if they abuse your rules, but don't create an issue of trust by snooping around like they've just committed a felony

give the kids a break...already have to deal with so much nowadays...harder tests.....harder to get into colleges....and every other thing that past generations had to deal with........the world is getting tougher and tougher.......let em breathe

that's just my young-minded .02 :)


No kidding. I'm stressing about this kind of stuff right now as a matter of fact. If my parents were snooping ON TOP of that, I would probably go crazy.:pissed:

Very good point, Yucarenow.:clap:

[aleonard]

:wave:
:wave::wave: from Sarge and Shyann.

[bluemtnrunner]

No kidding. I'm stressing about this kind of stuff right now as a matter of fact. If my parents were snooping ON TOP of that, I would probably go crazy.:pissed:

Very good point, Yucarenow.:clap:

But I have a very good relationship with all of my children.
My kid isn't freaking out about this though. She is fine with all of it. That is one of my points, his freak out over this, not hers. In fact she just came in and read this along with the guy's most recent post on my Facebook page (right next to the picture of his report card which he also posted today 3 A's, 2 B's and D..in history.)

His rebuttal:
I believe that this has ground in the Supreme Court. You may own the phone and pay the bill, But you daughter is an adult. I argue that any Communication between two adults (text message, Written, Or otherwise) Is protected under the constitution of the United States of America and is held to be Private. Protect children is one thing. Infringing on an adults right to privacy is another.

1)He reverses is earlier opinion that I can read the outgoing texts but not the incoming texts
2) The right to privacy (the word privacy) is not in the constitution.
3) My employer can read what I am writing right now because it is being on done on their computer
4) Newspaper Obtains Detroit Mayor's Text Messages
The Detroit Free Press reports today that it has obtained text messages showing that Mayor Kwame Kilpatrick and his chief of staff lied about their relationship when they testified in a police whistle-blower trial last summer....
go to the link to read the rest http://blog.washingtonpost.com/washingtonpostinvestigations/2008/01/newspaper_obtains_mayors_text.html (http://blog.washingtonpost.com/washingtonpostinvestigations/2008/01/newspaper_obtains_mayors_text.html)

So sue me!!! I felt that this guy was a total A$$. Believed my kid was not focusing on getting done with her last few months of school and her plan for after that because of their relationship. After I texted him, he freaked and has continued to freak and say a lot of things that are making my daughter and their other friends see a side of him that they did not believe existed. A side that I had the misfortune of seeing 6 months ago.

[aleonard]

But I have a very good relationship with all of my children.
My kid isn't freaking out about this though. She is fine with all of it. That is one of my points, his freak out over this, not hers. In fact she just came in and read this along with the guy's most recent post on my Facebook page (right next to the picture of his report card which he also posted today 3 A's, 2 B's and D..in history.)

His rebuttal:
I believe that this has ground in the Supreme Court. You may own the phone and pay the bill, But you daughter is an adult. I argue that any Communication between two adults (text message, Written, Or otherwise) Is protected under the constitution of the United States of America and is held to be Private. Protect children is one thing. Infringing on an adults right to privacy is another.

1)He reverses is earlier opinion that I can read the outgoing texts but not the incoming texts
2) The right to privacy (the word privacy) is not in the constitution.
3) My employer can read what I am writing right now because it is being on done on their computer
4) Newspaper Obtains Detroit Mayor's Text Messages
The Detroit Free Press reports today that it has obtained text messages showing that Mayor Kwame Kilpatrick and his chief of staff lied about their relationship when they testified in a police whistle-blower trial last summer....
go to the link to read the rest http://blog.washingtonpost.com/washingtonpostinvestigations/2008/01/newspaper_obtains_mayors_text.html (http://blog.washingtonpost.com/washingtonpostinvestigations/2008/01/newspaper_obtains_mayors_text.html)

So sue me!!! I felt that this guy was a total A$$. Believed my kid was not focusing on getting done with her last few months of school and her plan for after that because of their relationship. After I texted him, he freaked and has continued to freak and say a lot of things that are making my daughter and their other friends see a side of him that they did not believe existed. A side that I had the misfortune of seeing 6 months ago.

I am infuriated by his response. He needs to check back with the courts on that one. In many states communications are not considered private as per the means of transmission(cordless phone vs hard-line) and it's legal in many states(not Florida) to record a conversation as long as one person is aware, but not both parties. Other than that I agree with you. Let him sue. He will quickly find out how he has no legal standing in his argument. The Federal courts can't even find out how many Americans have been listened to by the current administration and he thinks this has been ruled on by the Supreme Court??????
I have withheld my vote on this one but now I say.........outa here with you kiddo.

Methinks he doth protest too much.........

[scooterbug44]

Methinks he will be on the news soon, and not for something good!

What a tool!

[aleonard]

Methinks he will be on the news soon, and not for something good!

What a tool!
Ditto:lolabove:

[steeleing1]

My parents' position was that they trusted you until something happened to betray that trust and then it was Gestapo time. They were big fans of "you're a kid, you have no rights" and "privileges must be earned".

I never thought it would, but this has become my parental position, too. Fortunately, I'm married to a former Marine who can easily turn into drill sergeant because I am a terrible one.

[ktschris]

I've struggled with this question for a few years now. And this is what I think:

The world has changed. Cyberspace has become our children's playground. If my son were to walk out the door to play with a group of kids, I would want to know who they were. So NO, I do not have a problem letting him know I have access to his text messages, myspace, and emails. It's my job as a parent to know who he is "hanging out" with and what he is doing. Almost half of the kids in his friends list, I don't know. If they were to come to the house, I would be able to talk with them and get to know them. But they are virtual strangers...so I read their profiles and their messages.

Don't get me wrong, I don't read everything, and honestly I haven't check his im's or myspace in a long time - but he knows I could if I wanted to.

[ShallowsNole]

I struggled with it too, until about 18 months ago - when my then 13-year-old son booted me off of his MySpace buddies list and informed me that he was sorry it had to come to this, but he wanted to be alone with his friends.

About this time, one of his best friends got involved with dope, and all the rest were dabbling in drinking. The grades dropped - not far, but they did drop. And, finally, along came the not-innocent girlfriend.

So yeah, I look. I don't snoop, I do surveillance. There is a difference. Again, the best way to keep a secret is don't write it down, don't take a picture, and don't tell anybody. But then I guess it just isn't any funn, if you are a teenager. :roll:

[TooFarTampa]

There are some great parents here. I always enjoy reading these threads, because as frightening as they may be, they always produce a lot of useful advice. :wave:

[seaside2]

Parents have a responsibility to raise children in a universally acceptable manner. If circumstances lead the parent to the conclusion that they need to read a text message, email, dairy, whatever, then they are compelled to do so. It comes out of love and a desire for what is ultimately the best for the kids. Parents are not friends to kids, they are parents. Very different relationship.

And while it has been a day or two since I was a kid, I distinctly remember not having very good judegement and being very emotionally involved in my own life (The he!! with everyone else) and needed someone to lead me through the mess.

Read the text messages as required. Kid doesn't like it? Tough. Take the cell phone away.

sounds harsh, but you gotta do what you gotta do.

[hnooe]

Parents have a responsibility to raise children in a universally acceptable manner. If circumstances lead the parent to the conclusion that they need to read a text message, email, dairy, whatever, then they are compelled to do so. It comes out of love and a desire for what is ultimately the best for the kids. Parents are not friends to kids, they are parents. Very different relationship.

And while it has been a day or two since I was a kid, I distinctly remember not having very good judegement and being very emotionally involved in my own life (The he!! with everyone else) and needed someone to lead me through the mess.

Read the text messages as required. Kid doesn't like it? Tough. Take the cell phone away.

sounds harsh, but you gotta do what you gotta do.
__________________________________________________ ________
Please clarify...what is a "universally acceptable manner" in which to raise children?

That logic sounds like the same ill begotten logic that President Bush is currently using on the American people (his administration is the parent in this case, and we are the children) to illegally wiretap telephone lines (yours and mine) in the name of "family security, and to do what his administration feels "is the best for the American people."


Instead of reading your kids text messages and "doing what you gotta do," I wish parents would spend real time with their children at the outset let them know what your expectations are, especially if you are paying for cell service, internet service, etc., and regardless of what their friends at school parents are doing. I know that the parents are as busy today, if not busier than the kids nowadays, but why cement the trust first verbally, and use reading text messaging only as a very last resort, if at all. I think they will respect you much more.

[seaside2]

__________________________________________________ ________
Please clarify...what is a "universally acceptable manner" in which to raise children?

That logic sounds like the same ill begotten logic that President Bush is currently using on the American people (his administration is the parent in this case, and we are the children) to illegally wiretap telephone lines (yours and mine) in the name of "family security, and to do what his administration feels "is the best for the American people."


Instead of reading your kids text messages and "doing what you gotta do," I wish parents would spend real time with their children at the outset let them know what your expectations are, especially if you are paying for cell service, internet service, etc., and regardless of what their friends at school parents are doing. I know that the parents are as busy today, if not busier than the kids nowadays, but why cement the trust first verbally, and use reading text messaging only as a very last resort, if at all. I think they will respect you much more.


Gosh, I was just trying to stay in the middle of the road here.

While I absolutely, positively agree with what you say about relationships with the kids coming first, my statement, if you can read my feeble mind was aimed at what I feel a parent should do WHEN WARRANTED.

Now, what that has to do with Bush and all that:idontno:

[scooterbug44]

Generally the posts (as I am reading them) are not advocating reading messages except as a last resort when there are concerns or as part of an explicitly stated deal with their kids as a way to monitor their behavior.

As in most cases the parents are paying for the accounts they are monitoring and they are just dealing wth THEIR kids, I don't think it has major political implications. :roll:

[peapod1980]

No kidding. I'm stressing about this kind of stuff right now as a matter of fact. If my parents were snooping ON TOP of that, I would probably go crazy.:pissed:

Very good point, Yucarenow.:clap:
Kase, this is not directed at you specifically, because you seem to be a great kid, but I would argue that there's nothing to stress about if there's nothing sketchy for parents to uncover.

[Johnrudy]

Kase, this is not directed at you specifically, because you seem to be a great kid, but I would argue that there's nothing to stress about if there's nothing sketchy for parents to uncover.
I think she just means stress in general. Why add to the day to day stress while having parents snoop & probe through your life, not that there's anything they would find. :idontno:

Compared to my teen years, my son is almost a perfect kid (which of course he is not). But if I added to his daily stress of meeting high expectations, competitive GPA's, college search, and ALL the rest of life, he'd be a total basket case - even if he wasn't doing anything sketchy. (I think that's what Kase means.)

[Kase626]

I think she just means stress in general. Why add to the day to day stress while having parents snoop & probe through your life, not that there's anything they would find. :idontno:

Compared to my teen years, my son is almost a perfect kid (which of course he is not). But if I added to his daily stress of meeting high expectations, competitive GPA's, college search, and ALL the rest of life, he'd be a total basket case - even if he wasn't doing anything sketchy. (I think that's what Kase means.)


That is exactly what I meant, JohnRudy. Sorry if I was a bit vague, Peapod.

[bluemtnrunner]

__________________________________________________ ________

Instead of reading your kids text messages and "doing what you gotta do," I wish parents would spend real time with their children at the outset let them know what your expectations are, especially if you are paying for cell service, internet service, etc., and regardless of what their friends at school parents are doing. I know that the parents are as busy today, if not busier than the kids nowadays, but why cement the trust first verbally, and use reading text messaging only as a very last resort, if at all. I think they will respect you much more.


I think the fact that my daughter and I had already discussed that I would look in if I thought something was going on is the reason that she is not upset over this. I am thankful for all of the conversations we have had over the past 18 years that made our relationship strong enough for her to see my logic. (Two years ago she was in a much different frame of mind and this would have been much different)
The guy has now deleted his post (the one I began this thread with) from his facebook and has asked that I do the same. The mutual friends that he shares with my daughter are not speaking to him because of his noisy fit. They wonder what he will do when angered in the future. Perhaps my fears were well founded.

[Santiago]

Sounds like your daughter is pretty sharp and has hooked up with a dumbazz. Happens all the time. She just needs to 86 the guy and find a guy worthy of her. And by the way, you absolutely did the right thing. Do what you think is right and make no apologies. Kids today need all the help they can get and your daughter is very fortunate that you care enough to be a little "nosey".

[Tootsie]

I feel your pain. Here's a similar thread I started before you joined the board I believe. Maybe it will help a bit. It's tough. Good luck.

Invasion of privacy ? (http://www.sowal.com/bb/showthread.php?t=16623&highlight=Invasion+privacy)

just read thru that entire thread. very interesting. I still believe that as the mom, I get to read anything and everything in the house and beyond.

My kids are little. . . so I haven't crossed this bridge yet. But I assure you I will be reading these things. Not continuously, but regularly. I would tell them when I handed the phone to them, or gave them a computer, or handed them car keys that these things are MINE. And they can BORROW them, but I have full access. I wouldn't be appologetic about it at all.

To the boys point, if there is something that could be taken out of context, than I would certainly give him the chance to explain himself before I jumped to conclusions. But I would urge them not to send messages that could be misleading. That is the root of the problem, IMO. Not that you read it.

Tis - I agree with you completely. just because teens today have full access to communication technology does not mean they can use these privileges (cell phone and computer) with no rules. we should certainly expect good decisions and choices in these matters. privacy is important, yes. but only to an extent. if your child knows your expectations, then they will have no problem with your checking in on them now and then.

However, blumtrunner's daughter is 18 years old. and she sounds like she is mature enough to handle herself on her own. from what I've read here, I think I could trust her to make her own choices. but I would certainly speak to her about the text message situation, and ask her to set limits for herself on communicating via text messaging or otherwise during certain hours of the night.

this is the only real problem I find with this entire incident: the boyfriend was unbelievably rude to the mom - not only that moment, but he continued to be disrespectful. there is no excuse for his rudeness to an adult, under any circumstances. he should apologize. what is wrong with these a-hole teens? surely he has shown his complete lack of character and your daughter can move on to better friends.

[Johnrudy]

just read thru that entire thread. very interesting. I still believe that as the mom, I get to read anything and everything in the house and beyond.

Well I still pretty much do. I don't actually turn the whole house upside down purposely looking for anything, but if it's carelessly laying out, it's viewed by me and anyone else. I'll say this tho, you wouldn't believe what I read and find out about other kids! :lol: Some things that would make some of these proper soccer moms' hair curl! :floor:

[Hollibird]

Shallows, I am with you! I have gone so far as to make up a fake myspace, he unknowingly added me as a friend, and I could read the comments of the not-so -innocent girls. horrible, drinking videos... these kids are 13, 14 yrs old. pot was a huge problem this year. One friend wrote "come over so we can smoke"... and my idiot son let that up on his screen when I walked into the room.

There are many key logger softwares that you can download that records every keystroke. you can find out user names and passwords that way, even free trial ones (all you need is to have them use the computer one time to find out the passwords.

He found out, thinks I am crazy. But I would have had no idea about his so-called friends if I hadn't done this. not to mention girls sending him picture in their bras!! again - 14 yr olds!!!

[wrobert]

There are many key logger softwares that you can download that records every keystroke. you can find out user names and passwords that way, even free trial ones (all you need is to have them use the computer one time to find out the passwords.


Most key logging software is easily detected by even the free antivirus scanners because they are used to obtain data.

The local police have a couple of fake myspace pages up. Very funny to me when someone who they had no idea is a major mover of pot in the area posts pictures of himself surrounded by huge plants and loads of cash. I guess people really believe the internet is private. It has also benefited them when they see pictures of local gangstas with guns and other weapons.

[Tootsie]

well, I do believe in respecting the child, so I don't think I would go undercover to spy on my child. (never say never). I hope not anyway. Any checking up on the kid should be with his full knowledge and it should be done with love and understanding and respect. It should not be a surprise - the child should expect that his parent will want to make sure he is safe and making good choices.

I think.

[Mango]

well, I do believe in respecting the child, so I don't think I would go undercover to spy on my child. (never say never). I hope not anyway. Any checking up on the kid should be with his full knowledge and it should be done with love and understanding and respect. It should not be a surprise - the child should expect that his parent will want to make sure he is safe and making good choices.

I think.

I agree completely tootsie.
I can't comment on what or what I wouldn't do since I don't have children, but I do remember being 18 and I am sure we all made our share of mistakes, bad boyfriends/girlfiends, stayed out too late etc. But my mother knew I had a head on my shoulders and never pryed. I knew she was always there if I needed to discuss an issue and we did frequently. We didn't have cell phones then, god I feel old, but there were nights that I would call my girlfriends who had private lines late at night and vice versa. That age group is going through self discovery and everything seems overly dramatic. I can certainly understand parents checking internet usage and myspace pages, but a cell phone and text messaging should be private even if you are paying for it. Personally at that age I paid for my own car, gas, insurance, had a job, and went to school.
If you've discussed her taking no responsibilty outside of just school to pay for some expenses and offered to cover the phone, then give her some breathing room with it.

I don't know what more transpired between you and the boyfiend and I am not asking, but he had a right to post on myface his feelings on the subject, the same way you had a right to post his query on here. I have to say it made me a little uncomfortable reading his post. He seemed desperate for answers as to whether it was judicious or not.

I'm glad you're daughter didn't do the freak , but give her some breathing room and let her make some mistakes on her own. The kids that I knew at that age who had parents breathing down there throats were the ones who went on to college and then all hail broke loose. It was like a new personality arose.

I know my opinion isn't the popular one on this thread so have at me if you want. :lol:

[ShallowsNole]

Mango, I would have agreed with you, before my son hit puberty.

And, as he gets older, I see him getting more space. My primary concern is that he is growing up much faster than I did, and I was pretty -uh- fast. :blush: I turned out OK, but it's a miracle.

[iwishiwasthere]

Mango, I would have agreed with you, before my son hit puberty.

And, as he gets older, I see him getting more space. My primary concern is that he is growing up much faster than I did, and I was pretty -uh- fast. :blush: I turned out OK, but it's a miracle.

I feel the exact same way about myself. :yikes: Both of my girls are way better, less sneaky,than I was. Maybe it was because I did not have too many rigid rules...just a few necessary ones. Regardless, our past taints our views of the present.

[Allifunn]

http://www.unc.edu/~fiser/Gumby/Archive/Puke.jpg
J/K...I was pretty opinionated on the other thread. Everyone has their own opinion, and I don't believe that anyone can tell others how to raise their kids...it is all in the heart of the parent, and how well you know your child. Looking at notes, texts and myspace comments is fine, if you believe in your heart that you are doing the right thing. I just have a problem with any one that feels it is their right to invade privacy when it is not warranted. If I had cause to worry about one of my kids...I would investigate throughly...luckly, both kids are open books with me...sometimes too much so....:shock: :biggrin: Their dad is awesome, and we have both raised 2 good kids. WHEW!!! (together and now separately)
Also, if you have a good rapport with your child(ren) and they know you are prone to "snooping" (for lack of a better word, I don't mean it to sound so harsh)) and are ok with it, then you have already set the ground rules. Doing it arbitrarily could lead to a potential problem with trust.

[Tootsie]

yes, allifunn. trust is an important thing to be respected and protected, and it goes both ways. shouldn't be a problem if you maintain an open and loving relationship, as you have done with your teens.

[bluemtnrunner]

Mango, I do agree with you that we need to give the kids space and to let them make mistakes. I didn't think that I would be one to read their texts or whatever but some of her past behaviors made me rethink that ( trying to date a 25 year old pizza delivery guy when she was 16 for one thing). She can have a level head on her shoulders but she is prone to knee jerk decisions which then take a lot of work to clean up.
I told her the other day that the reason I am being so overbearing right now is that the decisions she makes now will have a farther reaching impact than ever before in her life. She has been working all year on her post graduation plan and I would hate for her to throw that all away to go live in this guy's parent's basement and work for $9 an hour.

[Tootsie]

Mango, I do agree with you that we need to give the kids space and to let them make mistakes. I didn't think that I would be one to read their texts or whatever but some of her past behaviors made me rethink that ( trying to date a 25 year old pizza delivery guy when she was 16 for one thing). She can have a level head on her shoulders but she is prone to knee jerk decisions which then take a lot of work to clean up.
I told her the other day that the reason I am being so overbearing right now is that the decisions she makes now will have a farther reaching impact than ever before in her life. She has been working all year on her post graduation plan and I would hate for her to throw that all away to go live in this guy's parent's basement and work for $9 an hour.

oh mama, this is such an important time for her to make the right decisions. you are the mama. you know best!