MLM discussion

[JoshMclean]

Supposedly it is a legitimate mulit level marketing company affiliated with AT&T, Verizon, Nextel, Dish Network, etc...
Of course you are paid according to how many people you can sign u and so forth. Apparently this thing is pretty hot right now and supposedly you can make up to 50k/month blah blah blah.

I was wondering if anyone had experience with this company? I am having a background check done on them right now including pending lawsuits and financial health.

I know many people who have made money in these programs, am just looking for info on this specific company.

[Smiling JOe]

the question you have to ask is, are you making money by selling products, or are you making money by signing people up? If the first, it might be decent, but if the latter, RUN! What will you be selling, phone services?

[JoshMclean]

It's both SJ. From the best I have heard you get money for each person you sign up and the people they sign up. You also receive residuals on money they are saving.

The companies who have affiliated with Fortune High Tech offer discounts to those who use them. For example, when your cell phone contract runs out you sign up with one of the affiliates through FHTM. You then receive a 5-20% discount on your monthly bill through that affiliate. So essentially you are saving yourself money on things you are already paying for.
They say that these corporations are paying them big money as to gain long term clientele. I know several reputable people in this area that have jumped in hard. Didn't know if anyone here was involved and if they made any $?

[JoshMclean]

They are having a presentation and question/answer time tonight. It's at 7:30 tonight at Houston 8. Houston 8 is located between Sarah K's and Subway in the Best Buy parking lot.

I'm going to check it out. I'll look into anything that may make some money on the side. It's open to the public so anyone that may be interested should be there.

[scooterbug44]

Sounds like a pyramid telemarketing scheme. :idontno:

[JoshMclean]

In a way, but it seems like there's an opportunity to make some money. It's not really a scheme, but seems to be a legit business set up in that fashion. The background check just came back pretty clean. I just read several articles on the internet about the founder Paul Orberson that were very positive about him.

If you think about it a lot of businesses are kind of set up the same way. A Real Estate office is kind of set up the same way. Money trickles down from the broker. I know plenty of Real Estate companies that pay bonuses to agents for recruiting also.

[Smiling JOe]

I'd be running the other way. You are essentially a recruiter, and are not selling anything. How much money are they charging for you to attend the seminar, or to start up?

[Smiling JOe]

Josh, you are right about some real estate offices being set up for sharing income of people who you bring aboard. Keller Williams is one of those companies. However, most agents at Keller Williams are on board to sell real estate. Recruiting is secondary. The scenario in the model you present, you are not selling anything. You are simply recruiting people who recruit people, who recruit people.

[JoshMclean]

They are selling a service. They recruit people to use a service provider that is affiliated with them. Then when you switch to their provider you get a discount on your bills anyway. Essentially you would be saving yourself money. I don't know enough about it, but my interest has been peaked.
It's a $299 set up fee, but you would make that back after signing up 3 people. I just got off the phone with my private investigative buddy in California who told me that he hasn't ever been sued and been in business since 2001. That's pretty impressive for anyone running a business.

[beachmouse]

"This is not a pyramid scheme. It only looks kind of like a triangle..."

[Smiling JOe]

So they make $300 per person who signs up. You make $100 per person you sign up. I have plenty of information to know that you should RUN. I've ran a business longer than that, and knock on wood, I haven't been sued either. The Club isn't necessarily illegal. It is much like a buying club, where members receive discounts on items they buy from certain vendors who pay to be in the Club and they have to offer discounts in return. The company which is setting this up is really the only one making any money. Cell phone contracts are highly competitive right now, and anyone who knows what they are doing can negotiate with the cell phone reps for better rates or discounts on phones. If Alltel has the best reception around here and your Club doesn't have Alltel as a carrier, and you go with Company X, because they offer a discount, but now don't have decent reception, you have not gotten a deal. You have gotten hosed.

[Smiling JOe]

I remember when a guy I knew made an appointment to talk with me one day, many years ago. I thought he wanted to talk business, with him buying my services, because that is what he indicated. This was a retired man, former military. He came in as scheduled and started to tell me about the great business of selling long distance for telephones. I was polite, and declined, but I wanted to kick him out and slam the door. This is no different. Start pitching your friends and acquaintances about switching service providers and you will not have any friends.

[JoshMclean]

So they make $300 per person who signs up. You make $100 per person you sign up. I have plenty of information to know that you should RUN. I've ran a business longer than that, and knock on wood, I haven't been sued either. The Club isn't necessarily illegal. It is much like a buying club, where members receive discounts on items they buy from certain vendors who pay to be in the Club and they have to offer discounts in return. The company which is setting this up is really the only one making any money. Cell phone contracts are highly competitive right now, and anyone who knows what they are doing can negotiate with the cell phone reps for better rates or discounts on phones. If Alltel has the best reception around here and your Club doesn't have Alltel as a carrier, and you go with Company X, because they offer a discount, but now don't have decent reception, you have not gotten a deal. You have gotten hosed.


I don't disagree with you yet SJ. Yes, I would say that it is very similar to that type of club.

Also, there's a big difference in not being sued running a very large corporation and being a Realtor.

[scooterbug44]

I remember when a guy I knew made an appointment to talk with me one day, many years ago. I thought he wanted to talk business, with him buying my services, because that is what he indicated. This was a retired man, former military. He came in as scheduled and started to tell me about the great business of selling long distance for telephones. I was polite, and declined, but I wanted to kick him out and slam the door. This is no different. Start pitching your friends and acquaintances about switching service providers and you will not have any friends.

IMO it's sketchy and you are making yourself seem sketchy on a board of potential clients!

[JoshMclean]

I don't really understand why you would say that. You see something and say run because you don't understand it. I see something that peaks my interest so I investigate further. Two different mentalities I guess. That's why this thread was started to see if anyone had information on it. It might be a scam I will let you know what I think tonight.

[Blair]

That scheme ran through Memphis about 5 years ago.....They do everyhing possible to avoid it looking like a pyramid but when you cut through the sh!t, it is nothing but a pyramid. Get in on the ground floor and you can make some quick cash but will likely lose friends over it. See if there is a guy named Mark Younger that's in it....That's who pitched it to me....

[JoshMclean]

Thank you for the information.

[kurt]

I believe most MLMs that get very far are legal. That doesn't mean you should sign up. The ones I have seen are based on hype and duping people to some degree. The worst are ultimately based on preying upon the greed of family, friends, and the people in your community. This greed is often cloaked in talk of achieving hopes and dreams, in the form of cars, jewelry, homes, and stupendous vacations.

The bottom line is this - if you are able to be successful at MLM then you are the type of person who would be successfual at many different sales jobs. Successful sales of any product takes extreme hard work and perserverence. If you are suited for sales, pick a product and a company you feel reall good about.

I am interested in hearing how the meeting goes. After hyping the actual service and/or product, there is usually talk about getting in on the ground floor, and bragging about how many people so and so has under them, and the size of checks received.

Remember the general rule that 80% of sales are achieved by 20% of salespeople. I'd bet that in the case of MLMs those numbers are optimistic.

[JoshMclean]

Excellent post Kurt. That's what I've heard from most people who have done it before. I know a couple people who have been very successful in different types of MLMs. They all say that it's just like any other sales job. You must be willing to put in the hard work and believe in what you're selling. That's what draws me to Real Estate.

[Smiling JOe]

If you really want to check out the company, run it through ClarkHoward.com. If it is not already on there, shoot Clark an email for the scoop.

[SHELLY]

Josh...you can join whatever sect you want--but I guarantee, if one of these MLM pyramid scams/schemes get their hooks into you, it won't be long before your friends, family and acquaintances will be ducking for cover when you walk down the street.

AND IN THE END, YOU ONLY END UP WITH WONKS LIKE THIS GUY IN THE VIDEO....(Sounds like these guys are homing in on RE folks since they know they may be getting a bit hungry)


http://youtube.com/watch?v=-xCGHyGLQkY&feature=related
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[sowalgayboi]

Josh,

I used to work for Nextel, what this does is make you an indirect dealer for these providers. What it boils down to is that they have already produced the requirements to be an indirect dealer and then pass a small commission on to you. If your really interested in this please contact Sprint and ask them for an app. If I remember correctly you'll need the following:

A fax machine
A computer
A high speed internet connection
The ability to sell a product

They generally require a deposit of some sort to keep you honest and then you receive a commission on a monthly basis. Keep in mind if you are dishonest or don't follow thru with customers they will suck you dry on charge backs.

[barefootguy]

I haven't heard of the company, but I think you'd need quite a few more product lines for many people to be bringing in 50k/month.

I had been involved with an MLM for about a decade. This business is partnered with huge amount of major retail/service companies, so other than fresh produce you're buying everything else (including real estate) through your own business. It was a wonderful time, I made money, spent money, built some great friendships, worked my tail off, dreamed big, and learned an awful lot. I'd still be slaving away in a warehouse somewhere if it wasn't for that business and the wonderful people encouraging me to do something with my talents and skills.

The sad part about a lot of business ventures is that the same wonderful people you learn and get encouragement from can cause the whole thing to crumble by getting greedy and trying to cheat the system. You can't get rich quick. You may be able to make some quick gains here and there. I more than tripled my income by quitting my job, but it sure didn't make me rich. Building a strong profitable business takes time, money and a whole lot of sweat and endurance. I had a good size, growing business that fell apart when we lost trust in the folks "upline" from us. It was like breaking my leg half way through a marathon. I gave up, crawled out of the way, and then took all I learned and put it into something else.

With an MLM you definitely need to sell your products, but to really have a strong profitable business you need to first help a handful of other people "under you" build their businesses. It can't be just about the money. You've got to care enough about pouring everything you've got into some other peoples lives.

Just thought I'd throw out my 2 cents.

[Smiling JOe]

Josh, have you been able to convince anyone else to sign up with you, yet?

[Hollibird]

I dont understand what the problem is with MLM's... I know they work. The one I am involved with sells legitimate website domains. You just happen to get money for people who buy then under you,. You are paying for a website. and selling a website.

[jdarg]

It sounds like stepping on other people's heads to make money. MLM = shady and fishy. Like Amway, Excel, Herbalife.

I'm not the biggest Wikipedia fan, but they give a great summary here:

"In the most legitimate MLM companies, commissions are earned only on sales of the company's products or services. No money may be earned from recruiting alone ("sign-up fees"), though money earned from the sales of members recruited is one attraction of MLM arrangements. If participants are paid primarily from money received from new recruits, or if they are required to buy more product than they are likely to sell, then the company is a pyramid (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pyramid_scheme) or Ponzi scheme (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ponzi_scheme), which is illegal in most countries."

[Smiling JOe]

I'm curious as to the number of emails Josh sent regarding recruiting vs the number he sent regarding selling the products of the MLM. I think the answer will tell us exactly that which he is selling.

[jdarg]

I dont understand what the problem is with MLM's... I know they work. The one I am involved with sells legitimate website domains. You just happen to get money for people who buy then under you,. You are paying for a website. and selling a website.




[/URL]

[/B]I just looked at this website. Tell me again, what is the product? There is no product mentioned. It is all about signing up people. Scamola.

Why do people fall for these things? Many years ago, Amway people tried to get us to fall for their deal. It was so obvious from the get go that it was creepy- and Amway even had some product to sell. These new ones, like this Freedom.ws touted in the website above, don't even pretend to be on the up and up. Hollibird, you are better than this crap. So are you Josh.

[Smiling JOe]

Jdarg, although the website looks like it's all about how to make a bunch of money, I think it is supposedly about selling website domains, although I couldn't find where I actually sign up for to see if a name has been taken, nor do I see where I can purchase a domain name. However, I do see how to get rich quickly. Here's how one person did it:

The Movie Does All The Work.
"My income has almost doubled each and every month... All you have to do is invite people to watch your movie." →

I think it is funny that all the domain names for that company end in .ws rather than a choice of .com, .org, etc.

[jdarg]

Jdarg, although the website looks like it's all about how to make a bunch of money, I think it is supposedly about selling website domains, although I couldn't find where I actually sign up for to see if a name has been taken, nor do I see where I can purchase a domain name. However, I do see how to get rich quickly. Here's how one person did it:

The Movie Does All The Work.
"My income has almost doubled each and every month... All you have to do is invite people to watch your movie." →

I know! I couldn't find anything but watching movies of people telling me how they doubled the income. Where are the websites to buy/sell?

So, it looks easy! You wanna be my business partner?:lol:

[Smiling JOe]

not if it means marketing it to all my friends, thereby getting on their spam lists. I'd rather keep my friends.

[jdarg]

not if it means marketing it to all my friends, thereby getting on their spam lists. I'd rather keep my friends.

No kidding. I have a hard time selling stuff to my friends that I can't explain or something they can't eat.

[SHELLY]

I dont understand what the problem is with MLM's... I know they work. The one I am involved with sells legitimate website domains. You just happen to get money for people who buy then under you,. You are paying for a website. and selling a website.






Lots of Who-Ha on the web about ".WS" I must admit, this is the first time I've heard of it. I know a lot more about this MLM now than I care to (these MLM things fascinate me--the proliferation of which seems to be a leading indicator that folks are becoming aware we're in a recession.)

OK ...test time:

(1) When was GDI originally established as a business?
(2) What was the year that GDI was #37 in INC.'s top 500?
(3) Will this video help this guy get the GDI promise of "Income for Life?"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BBoBINjvF1c



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[TooFarTampa]

Lots of Who-Ha on the web about ".WS" I must admit, this is the first time I've heard of it. I know a lot more about this MLM now than I care to (these MLM things fascinate me--the proliferation of which seems to be a leading indicator that folks are becoming aware we're in a recession.)

OK ...test time:

(1) When was GDI originally established as a business?
(2) What was the year that GDI was #37 in INC.'s top 500?
(3) Will this video help this guy get the GDI promise of "Income for Life?"



1) Mid-1990s
2) 2002
3) :floor:

SHELLY because I am obsessive I was Googling around about the same time last night, and I found it interesting to learn that .ws stands for Western Samoa, but is being marketed as standing for WebSite. Basically this company was trolling around for growth opportunities in the mid 90s and decided this domain name might have some.

But nose around and it is clear that to the major companies, .ws is junk. For example, if you type in Nordstrom.biz, Nordstrom.info, Nordstrom.org it will take you to the Nordstrom.com front page. Nordstrom did not buy .ws however because right now and apparently for the forseeable future, it considers it valueless.

That and a number of other big-name .ws names (Microsoft, Yahoo, etc) are "parked" by so called investors. They were available to the public only because when GDI first offered the .ws names directly to Fortune 500 companies, they declined -- according to GDI's own information. I think those companies know whether something is valuable or not.

If this were a viable product, it would be not be so bad of an idea, but a cursory search leads me to believe there is almost nothing in the .ws category besides millions of sales pitches. Yikes! Run Holli Run!

[jdarg]

And I can't imagine anything more demeaning than realizing that I was part of somebody's "upline".

[kurt]

Thanks TFT.

Everyone - please do not put working MLM links on this site in posts, profiles, or signatures. Thanks!

[Smiling JOe]

I dont understand what the problem is with MLM's... I know they work. The one I am involved with sells legitimate website domains. You just happen to get money for people who buy then under you,. You are paying for a website. and selling a website.:yikes: I just re-read this. Wow! So, you buy a website, promoting websites to others, and their website does nothing but promote more websites. Interesting. Sounds like the, "send me $30 and I'll tell you how to make millions by mailing letters from home," scheme. Send in your $30 and you will be told to ask others to send in their $30 and you share this same information, telling others to send in... repeat....

Hollibird, didn't you and Josh work in the same office at one time? Did you sell him on the MLM?

[chrisv]

I've been too busy stuffing envelopes, what is this thread about?;-)

[SHELLY]

:yikes: I just re-read this. Wow! So, you buy a website, promoting websites to others, and their website does nothing but promote more websites. Interesting. Sounds like the, "send me $30 and I'll tell you how to make millions by mailing letters from home," scheme. Send in your $30 and you will be told to ask others to send in their $30 and you share this same information, telling others to send in... repeat....


DING, DING, DING...we've got a winner folks! Thanks SJ for connecting the dots. As I was researching the ".WS" pitch, I had a feeling that this scheme sounded familiar, but I just couldn't put my finger on it--your observation is 100% spot on!


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[Hollibird]

You are paying $10 a month for your own website.... a website that you can do anything with... dont a lot of you have your own website?

[Hollibird]

Like I said, you dont have to even promote this business on your website... you can do whatever you want with it.... its yours. and i am sure alot of people here pay someone to host thier own website.

[Smiling JOe]

Yep. I pay less than $10 per year for my domain name. What do yours costs? Just curious why you chose your site to have nothing but advertisements on how people made money by getting others to create a website like yours.

Not intending to pick on you, just trying to understand why people buy into such things. I'm guessing that you are out of the Realtor biz, or you you probably be advertising real estate on your site.

[Smiling JOe]

what does one of your website domain names cost? I couldn't find any info on your site, other than info-mercials.

[SHELLY]

Take a look at this messageboard for GDI groupies (in this case, the "Marketing" section)....it is not about "just" selling domain names:

http://talk.ws/index.php?PHPSESSID=d98bfd851676920697f885fc8b7109 10&board=10.0

One area talks about using "social networking sites" (i.e., facebook...maybe SOWAL.COM??) to "build relationships."

I applaud Kurt for recognizing this MLM as spam-crap and keeping it off the board.

Here's a sample from the board as to how to talk to "leads" you get from your website:

Here is a script that I just wrote for my team to use. Key things to remember.

#1 You MUST speak clearly and confidently. Try standing up with good posture while you talk especially if you have a weak voice or are not comfortable on the phone.

#2 Don't mention money. If the person asks how much you are making, DO NOT TELL THEM. Your reply should be something like this...I don't like to give that information out so soon. The reason being, I don't want to create any false hopes. This is a business, and you do have to put some effort into it. I don't know how much time and effort you are willing to put into your business right now. You can ask me again in a few months but even then I am not promising you I will tell you anything. We will see how much YOU are making in 6 months! Isn't that is what is important.

If they ask how much it costs...Nothing for 7 days. So cost doesn't matter right now, what does is whether or not you can SEE the potential to earn a nice living. (kinda light heartedly...) You might have to skip McDonalds once or twicea month to cover your overhead. It doesnt matter anyway because your BUSINESS should be making a PROFIT!

#3 The purpose of this call is NOT TO SELL AN OPPORTUNITY. It is to HELP your prospect start their own business

Hello "name",

How are you doing today?
My name is...
I just want to let you know that this is not a sales call. In FACT, I am not going to ask you to buy a thing. I only ask for 30 seconds of your time. I do however, have ONE question for you to answer before I continue.

Are you the type of person that would be interested in the possibility of owning your own business and working from the comfort of your own home?(see responses below)

(IF NO)_ I am sorry to hear that, unfortunately this information is not for you. I am sorry to have waisted your time. If you ever decide that you are this type of person...go to www.my.ws and put in (your user name) as the access code. (People do not like to be left out so wait a few seconds and see if they bite and ask for the info then continue with the yes response)
Good bye "name"

(IF YES)Great! You must be a high achiever. Have you ever heard of Global Domains international?(probably not)GDI is the sole distributor of .ws (DOT WS) domains worldwide.
.ws Stands for WebSite just like .com stands for commercial.
Right now there are approximately 30 Million domain names registered accross the world. That number is expected to BOOM to over 500 Million in the next 10 years which is a HUGE opportunity to be leveraged IF you position yourself correctly right now.

Do you have a few minutes and access to the internet right now so you can watch a short movie that GDI has spent a quarter of a million dollars producing and does a much better job of explaining this BUSINESS than I can?

(IF NO)That is ok, If you can grab a pencil and paper, I will give you the website address so you can go to it when you do have the time. Do you have it...OK good. You NEED to go to www.my.ws

Your access code will be(your GDI username)

Just fill in the short form so the movie can be customized for you...they characters will actually say your name. It is pretty neat. Just make sure that your speakers are turned up.

Do you have any questions?
(answer any that you can somewhat vaguely. You goal is to get them to watch the movie by stressing that it will explain it all)

(IF YES)<Get them to go to www.my.ws The access code is your username. Then they will need to fill out their name and email address. Try to stay on the line with them and walk them all the way through the signup process. Even though you can sign up for the free trial without a payment method, try to get them to put that info in there because it will lower your drop-out rate significantly. Point out that they will not be charged until AFTER the 7 day trial anyway.



In the event you get an answering machine

Hi my name is....
It has been brought to my attention that you or someone in your household has been looking for infomation about starting a home business. If this is true go to www.my.ws Your access code will be(your username). Go check it out! You can reach me at...if you have any questions.


I hope this helps.

Brian Perrone

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[elgordoboy]

Careful Shelly, about halfway through the pitch and I am ready to sign up. I had to break and come to my senses.

[beachbob]

You are paying $10 a month for your own website.... a website that you can do anything with... dont a lot of you have your own website?

Like I said, you dont have to even promote this business on your website... you can do whatever you want with it.... its yours. and i am sure alot of people here pay someone to host thier own website.

I got an email from Josh last week too....

Fellow Realtors,
Would you like to make extra income while the market remains slow? I have found the answer to that. I have joined up with a company called Fortune Hi-Tech Marketing. This company is solid as I have done a background check on them and checked them through the BBB. They are a debt free company that has a perfect credit ranking. This company is really going to take off over the next 24 months.


This company has been backed by Forbes and Fox news. You can check out this site here to learn a little more about the company.


We are having a meeting on it tonight at 6:30 in Miramar Beach if you would like to see what it's about.
Address and Directions:
408 Walton Way Miramar Beach 6:30 p.m Tonight!

Please call or email me if you have any questions,
Josh McLean

[Smiling JOe]

Josh, you didn't tell us that you were having an Open House/MLM marketing meeting, in that nice Bayfront Home. Did you remove the for sale sign to impress the others who were coming for the MLM, or did you leave the sign up and hope that the MLM peeps would forget about the MLM and want a tour of the home? Good strategy, either way.

[FLSunChaser]

I got an email from Josh last week too....

Fellow Realtors,
Would you like to make extra income while the market remains slow? I have found the answer to that. I have joined up with a company called Fortune Hi-Tech Marketing. This company is solid as I have done a background check on them and checked them through the BBB. They are a debt free company that has a perfect credit ranking. This company is really going to take off over the next 24 months.


This company has been backed by Forbes and Fox news. You can check out this site here to learn a little more about the company.


We are having a meeting on it tonight at 6:30 in Miramar Beach if you would like to see what it's about.
Address and Directions:
408 Walton Way Miramar Beach 6:30 p.m Tonight!

Please call or email me if you have any questions,
Josh McLean


I think all the realtors got this email. IF one more calls me to sign up I'm gonna go postal on them. My guess is in 6 months they'll be looking for the next get rich scheme so they can keep driving their BMW's and Mercedes for another month. Amway, Excel phone cards, Shacklee, Send Out Cards. . .broke a** realtors will try anything. . .Josh should have held it at the Destiny Worship Center and everyone could "pray" about it together and at the same time, just maybe the real estate market will turn around and all these Fortune Marketing "realtors" can sign up all their so called friends.

[sowalgayboi]

Anybody remember Don Lapre?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Don_Lapre

This guy is soooo annoying.

[SHELLY]

Josh, you didn't tell us that you were having an Open House/MLM marketing meeting, in that nice Bayfront Home.


Got Snacks???? :popcorn:



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[sowalgayboi]

Josh, you didn't tell us that you were having an Open House/MLM marketing meeting, in that nice Bayfront Home. Did you remove the for sale sign to impress the others who were coming for the MLM, or did you leave the sign up and hope that the MLM peeps would forget about the MLM and want a tour of the home? Good strategy, either way.

I wonder if the owners of said house are aware it is now a convention/meeting hall? :blink:

[beachbob]

That's a good question. Here is another. Is Josh's broker aware that their logo is the signature line for Josh's email about MLM meetings?

[wrobert]

Anyone remember when Glenn Turner's 'Dare to be Great' program made it through the area? I know a few people in NoWal that were several thousand dollars poorer after going to one of those meetings.

[chrisv]

Anybody remember Don Lapre?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Don_Lapre

This guy is soooo annoying.

Back in the mid 1990's when he was at his peak (infomercials every night), he walked into my bar in Vail. I carded him because he looked young, and when I saw his name it clicked who he was. He turned out to be pretty cool and was a good tipper:D

[John R]

The common factor of all those youtube testimonial/recruitment videos is that they look like they were made with 'my first editing suite'. With all that money they're making, you'd figure they would put some of it back into marketing materials produced professionally. Also, a good portion of them use stock photos of boats, planes, luxury cars, etc. It would be more of a true testimonial if they were standing next to their own assets.

[SHELLY]

It would be more of a true testimonial if they were standing next to their own assets.

http://users.ilnk.com/geraldr/Gerald%20Pic/GRChevy.JPG


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[gypsy639]

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Consequently what is coming around is the return to Consumer Driven Fee-For-Service medical and dental care.

The leading proponent of the “new” old approach to health care is a Seattle based non-profit group named American Association of Patients and Providers (AAPP). They named their approach “SimpleCare”.

SimpleCare was the brainchild of two Seattle physicians, Vern S. Cherewatenko and David McDonald, who tired of 3rd party payers underpaying to the point of loosing money on each treatment performed.

The doctors decided to offer substantially lower fees to patients who would pay cash at the time of service. That change in procedure allowed them to avoid 3rd party payers and dramatically lower their administrative costs.

In a typical treatment scenario, the doctor sees a patient who has come in suffering from the flu. The visit lasts 10 minutes for diagnosis and medication prescription. The staff submits a $79.00 bill to the patients HMO. After a wait of 90 days the doctor’s office receives payment of $43.00 for the service.

The administrative cost for processing the bill is about $20.00, leaving the doctor with a “profit” of $23.00. Not so fast, the overhead for that patient is $30.00. Simple math shows the doctor lost $7.00 treating that patient.

This is not a hypothetical situation. Before SimpleCare, Cherewatenko’s practice had 55 doctors and was losing $80,000 a month due to 3rd party underpayments.

Since implementing SimpleCare, the doctors now charge the flu patient $35.00 if they pay by cash, check or credit card. Again, simple math shows the doctor earned $5.00 instead of a loss of $7.00. The doctors can now avoid bankruptcy, a very real threat to many doctors due to low reimbursements from all 3rd party payers, both public (Medicare and Medicaid) and private (HMO’s, PPO’s etc.).

The consumer wins too. They get the full attention of the doctor, free of “maximum per-patient time limits” and not treatment determined by a distant stranger. The concept of SimpleCare represents a dramatic departure from the “business as usual” model in health care financing. Most important, the patient receives the best healthcare at a reasonable cost.

Today, most health care is paid for through an expensive system known as 3rd party payers, where the 3rd party is an insurance company or a government agency. Many health care experts point to this system as the primary reason we in the U.S. face double-digit health insurance premium inflation and intrusion into our doctor’s decision-making process.

According to renowned economist Milton Friedman, in his analysis, “How To Cure Health Care”, two simple observations are key to the high level of spending on medical care and the dissatisfaction with that spending. The first is that most payments to physicians or hospitals or other caregivers for medical care are made not by the patient, but by a 3rd party. The second is that nobody spends somebody else’s money as wisely or as frugally as he/she spends their own.

Friedman also adds, “no 3rd party is involved when we shop at a supermarket. We pay the supermarket clerk directly. The same for gasoline for our car, clothes on our back and so on down the line.”

The majority has no choice in their health plans since the plans are employer provided. As a result they have no incentive to spend health care dollars wisely, nor do they have much, if any, opportunity to participate in the health care process.

Studies have shown that consumers tied to 3rd party payers may feel they are spending “someone else’s money” and therefore tempted to request unnecessary tests, treatments and other services. Insurers have responded by installing “gate keepers” to review and approve or deny requests for treatments.

James Henderson, author of Health Economics and Policy (Southwestern Publishing, 1999) and professor of economics at Baylor University, describes a classis example of how spending someone else’s money distorts the decision making process.

Henderson writes about a documented case where a 70-year-old man suffering from a ruptured abdominal aortic aneurysm was brought to the hospital and spent weeks in an intensive care unit. The bill approached $275,000, none of which was paid by the patient.

The man’s physician determined that poor eating caused by poorly fitting dentures caused his slow recovery. The doctor requested the hospital dentist perform the needed adjustments. Later the doctor discovered the man had not allowed the hospital dentist to perform the needed adjustments. When asked for a reason, the patient replied, “$75.00 is a lot of money.” Medicare would not pay for the adjustment, so it would have been an out of pocket cost.

The nations reliance on 3d party insurance is expensive and getting more so every year. The cost of health care and insurance coverage has been inflated many times over to cover the expense of having a 3rd party involved in the process.

Is it any wonder then, that programs that promise to return to the older model of patient choice and responsibility are increasingly more popular?

What started out with two doctors has grown into about 500,000 doctors and providers in all disciplines serving nearly 6,000,000 patients in all states. Even some of the largest insurance companies are venturing into the world of Consumer Driven Health Care, but their efforts look a lot like their insured plans with controls and “cost containment”. They just will never learn.

Compliments to Conrad F. Meier and Milton Friedman.

[30A Skunkape]

beware, MLM pitch ahead:roll:

[SHELLY]

beware, MLM pitch ahead:roll:


Not a very effective MLM advert since I found the bald freak uber-annoying and clicked it off about 7 seconds into the pitch. :confused:


.

[gypsy639]

Skunkape, I resent your reply. Nowhere in post or website am I promoting MLM. I am presenting facts that are supported by studies and referring anyone who is interested in an alternative to a broken healthcare system.

gypsy639

[SHELLY]

Skunkape, I resent your reply. Nowhere in post or website am I promoting MLM. I am presenting facts that are supported by studies and referring anyone who is interested in an alternative to a broken healthcare system.

gypsy639

Ameriplan is MLM the promotion of which is at the end of the post:

To see what the “new” old system can do for you, I invite you



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hz3SUXRVj6M&feature=related


The following information is a summary of our research regarding inforamtion on the so called AmeriPlan Scam'.

AmeriPlan is a provider access organization that uses brokers to provide supplemental health benefits to members. AmeriPlan Corporation arranges for members to have access to dental, vision, prescription drug and chiropractic providers who have agreed to offer their services at negotiated discounts off their usual and customary fees.

The AmeriPlan business opportunity pays out a variety of commissions and bonuses to its brokers based on member acquisition.

AmeriPlan claims to be an insurance company. However, AmeriPlan benefits are not insurance. Participants must use an AmeriPlan provider in order to receive any discount.

The AmeriPlan scam takes place when a representative calls offering 2,500 dollar credit card for $249. This card can be used for medical expenses supposedly covered under AmeriPlan. The caller informs the potential client that they will receive the card in the mail before their bank account is debited. This is not the case.

If a customer asks for more information they are told they will not receive any information until they send their payment.

Often customers do not receive their card yet their accounts are debited the $249.

When the customer calls to find out about the charges they are told they can no longer get the $249 deal. Of course the customers' next move is to try to cancel their account with AmeriPlan. Customers are told they cannot cancel their account over the phone and that they will have to fill out a cancellation form via the internet.

It has been reported that this cancellation process does not work. Customers call back to AmeriPlan and are told to fill out the form online and that nothing else can be done, leaving the customer in a catch 22 situation.

AmeriPlan claims these cases are isolated and that they, "have never had any of these complaints." However, any internet search on The AmeriPlan Scam will yield an alarming number of consumer complaints.


.

[30A Skunkape]

Skunkape, I resent your reply. Nowhere in post or website am I promoting MLM. I am presenting facts that are supported by studies and referring anyone who is interested in an alternative to a broken healthcare system.

gypsy639

Give us all a break...it is (yet) another MLM scam that is more tasteless than most since it preys on people without health insurance.

I am afraid JoshMclean and Hollibird already recruited all the SOWALers who might have been interested in MLM. You can read all about it on this thread: http://www.sowal.com/bb/showthread.php?t=19455 That is about all that needs to be said.

[goodwitch58]

Except maybe that: politicians listening to Milton Friedman (may he RIP) has a lot to do with the economic situation we find ourselves in now.

[gypsy639]

Ameriplan is MLM the promotion of which is at the end of the post:



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hz3SUXRVj6M&feature=related


The following information is a summary of our research regarding inforamtion on the so called AmeriPlan Scam'.

AmeriPlan is a provider access organization that uses brokers to provide supplemental health benefits to members. AmeriPlan Corporation arranges for members to have access to dental, vision, prescription drug and chiropractic providers who have agreed to offer their services at negotiated discounts off their usual and customary fees.

The AmeriPlan business opportunity pays out a variety of commissions and bonuses to its brokers based on member acquisition.

AmeriPlan claims to be an insurance company. However, AmeriPlan benefits are not insurance. Participants must use an AmeriPlan provider in order to receive any discount.

The AmeriPlan scam takes place when a representative calls offering 2,500 dollar credit card for $249. This card can be used for medical expenses supposedly covered under AmeriPlan. The caller informs the potential client that they will receive the card in the mail before their bank account is debited. This is not the case.

If a customer asks for more information they are told they will not receive any information until they send their payment.

Often customers do not receive their card yet their accounts are debited the $249.

When the customer calls to find out about the charges they are told they can no longer get the $249 deal. Of course the customers' next move is to try to cancel their account with AmeriPlan. Customers are told they cannot cancel their account over the phone and that they will have to fill out a cancellation form via the internet.

It has been reported that this cancellation process does not work. Customers call back to AmeriPlan and are told to fill out the form online and that nothing else can be done, leaving the customer in a catch 22 situation.

AmeriPlan claims these cases are isolated and that they, "have never had any of these complaints." However, any internet search on The AmeriPlan Scam will yield an alarming number of consumer complaints.


.
Shelly

In response to your post: You state Ameriplan "claim" to be an insurance company. I challange you to find and post any official Ameriplan document where the insurance company claim is made.

You also stated Ameriplan scam representative calls offering $2500 credit card for $249. I again challange you to prove that statement. such a product does not exist in product portfolio.

Since your post is now part of the public domain and slander and liable is evident, your post has been forwarded to Ameriplan Legal Department for their review.

Have a nice day

[wrobert]

Except maybe that: politicians listening to Milton Friedman (may he RIP) has a lot to do with the economic situation we find ourselves in now.


Hey, I resemble that statement.

Whatever happened to Josh. He use to post on here from time to time but since the MLM he seems to have disappeared.

[wrobert]

Shelly

In response to your post: You state Ameriplan "claim" to be an insurance company. I challange you to find and post any official Ameriplan document where the insurance company claim is made.

You also stated Ameriplan scam representative calls offering $2500 credit card for $249. I again challange you to prove that statement. such a product does not exist in product portfolio.

Since your post is now part of the public domain and slander and liable is evident, your post has been forwarded to Ameriplan Legal Department for their review.

Have a nice day


Beemn?

[SHELLY]

Shelly

Since your post is now part of the public domain and slander and liable is evident, your post has been forwarded to Ameriplan Legal Department for their review.

Have a nice day

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:floor:

Remember the name is SHELLY....not like Shirl Shelley from Ameriplan who was identified in the $200,000 Settlement for fraud allegations in Montana back in Nov 2006:

"In July, Morrison issued a cease and desist order after charging AmeriPlan USA, its founding officers, Dennis and Daniel Bloom, and Shirl Shelley, a Montana resident, with numerous violations of both the Montana Insurance Code and the Montana Securities Act.

AmeriPlan and its agents and officers were accused of failing to contract with the medical care providers (including doctors, nurse practitioners, physician's assistants and hospitals) they advertise as participants in AmeriPlan's medical care discount program. The Auditor alleged that more than 700 Montana AmeriPlan members in the state were unable to use the discount cards because there were few, if any, providers in Montana. Additionally, AmeriPlan is charged with conducting an illegal pyramid promotional scheme because it sold "broker packages" for the purpose of recruiting memberships. Because the memberships were for discounts that did not exist, Morrison alleged there was no actual product being sold. AmeriPlan's largest source of income in Montana was from the sales of these "broker packages," according to the Auditor's charging document."

http://www.insurancejournal.com/news/west/2006/11/22/74554.htm

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[elgordoboy]

:blink:
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:floor:

Remember the name is SHELLY....not like Shirl Shelley from Ameriplan who was identified in the $200,000 Settlement for fraud allegations in Montana back in Nov 2006:

"In July, Morrison issued a cease and desist order after charging AmeriPlan USA, its founding officers, Dennis and Daniel Bloom, and Shirl Shelley, a Montana resident, with numerous violations of both the Montana Insurance Code and the Montana Securities Act.

AmeriPlan and its agents and officers were accused of failing to contract with the medical care providers (including doctors, nurse practitioners, physician's assistants and hospitals) they advertise as participants in AmeriPlan's medical care discount program. The Auditor alleged that more than 700 Montana AmeriPlan members in the state were unable to use the discount cards because there were few, if any, providers in Montana. Additionally, AmeriPlan is charged with conducting an illegal pyramid promotional scheme because it sold "broker packages" for the purpose of recruiting memberships. Because the memberships were for discounts that did not exist, Morrison alleged there was no actual product being sold. AmeriPlan's largest source of income in Montana was from the sales of these "broker packages," according to the Auditor's charging document."

http://www.insurancejournal.com/news/west/2006/11/22/74554.htm

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I really am glad you are able to laugh --my head nearly exploded.

[SHELLY]

I really am glad you are able to laugh --my head nearly exploded.

Why not laugh....this Ameriplan sham stuff is all over the internet. Here's the article I quoted above: http://www.corporatenarc.com/ameriplanscam.php

Ads like this: http://www.homebaseddream.com/
"AmeriPlan® offers a great work at home opportunity that ANYONE can do! Our company is the nation's largest provider of discounted health benefits in the United States."

Lead companies hawking referrals: http://www.betterbusinessreferral.com/customsurveyedamp.htm
"This surveyed lead is generated for Ameriplan Representives only! This lead an exclusive lead and will only be sold to one Ameriplan Sales Representive. These leads are generated using targeted webpage advertising, direct mail surveys, and pop up forms. "



"Brokers" websites: http://www.agoodwebsite.com/home_based_earning_opportunities.htm
"Multiple tiers exist in the Ameriplan MLM program. These tiers allow the person who refers you to the plan to earn as well as people in your down line. This helps you build income as you sell but also brings in residual incomes for you so the effort you make on a single discount health plan sale can bring you income again and again over the course of many years."

Multiple tiers, downlines, residual incomes....:scratch: Where have we heard talk like that before?? http://www.sowal.com/bb/showthread.php?t=19455

When the economy goes into the crapper, these type of "get rich quick, at home, in your own time" MLM businesses always float to the surface.

AND THEN THERE'S THIS:

AmeriPlan® is committed to a zero-tolerance, anti-Spamming policy. If you have any complaints or comments regarding Spam on our network, please direct them via e-mail to:Abuse@ameriplanusa.com



Have a nice day :cool:



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[gypsy639]

Shelly, I'm surprised. I thought you had your hand on the pulse of the matter. After reviewing the sites you reference, it appears you are just regurgitating other false information. Come on, show some originality. You did not even have the common courtesy to post the letter from Ameriplan refuting the false claims in the site you referenced.

The other sites you cited have absolutely nothing to do with Ameriplan.

It appears to me that you are a frustrated former MLM loser.

A little research on you part would reveal that Ameriplan has would nbeen in existence since 1992 and is not a "Scam" just created due to "bad economic times".

Since you would not post Ameriplan's reply, here it is:


AmeriPlan claims to be an insurance company.

FACT: Ameriplan states all over ever website of ours and every brochure and every DVD that we are NOT insurance. This statement is totally false.

YOUR SITE CLAIMS: The AmeriPlan scam takes place when a representative calls offering 2,000 dollar credit card for $249. This card can be used for medical expenses supposedly covered under AmeriPlan. The caller informs the potential client that they will receive the card in the mail before their bank account is debited. This is not the case.

FACT: Ameriplan does not have a $2000 dollar credit card.

FACT: We have NO startup option for $249. Sounds like whoever made this false claim is a very confused person.

FACT: We clearly state that our program offers deep discounts on medical expenses and that our members pay for the service at the time of service.

FACT: The person making this false claim mentions "the caller" but no name is given. They imply that "the caller" is reading from a company script, but there is NO company script. IF an IBO told them their card would arrive before their bank account was debited, then that ONE IBO did not give truthful information. That does not make our company or the other 70,000+ IBOs bad.

YOUR SITE CLAIMS: If a customer asks for more information they are told they will not receive any information until they send their payment.

FACT: Once again, WHO are they asking? They are asking an IBO who is working out of their home as and Independent Business Owner. No company can police what an independent contractor says from their home phone. The fact is that if a potential customer wants more information, there is a wealth of information about Ameriplan available to them via many web sites, DVDs, and brochures. To make this claim is totally irresponsible and shows that www.corporatenarc.com is not interested in doing the slightest effort at finding the truth, but rather only in proliferating any accusation regardless if it true OR NOT.

YOUR SITE CLAIMS: Often customers do not receive their card yet their accounts are debited the $249.

FACT: Ameirplan does not have a startup option for $249, and if a membership (customer) does not receive a card, they can easily call Ameriplan and request another be sent. The number one reason a member does not receive a card is that the member (customer) mistypes their own address when they sign up or if they are mailing or faxing an application their handwritting is illegible. To make the absurb claim that that "OFTEN customers do not receive their card" is to assume that the idiot who wrote this is somehow God who knows exactly how many cards were ordered and how many did not arrive into the hands of the membership. Furthermore, we have found other members who claimed not to have received their cards -- who actually found their cards when they asked other family members about their MAIL.

YOUR SITE CLAIMS: When the customer calls to find out about the charges they are told they can no longer get the $249 deal. Of course the customers' next move is to try to cancel their account with AmeriPlan. Customers are told they cannot cancel their account over the phone and that they will have to fill out a cancellation form via the internet.

FACT: There is not a "$249 deal".

FACT: If Ameriplan cancelled anyone who just "called in to cancel" then anyone could call Ameriplan and cancel other people's account that they did not like. As any professional company would have the same policy, Ameriplan needs cancellation information in writing to prove that it is the MEMBER wishing to cancel and not someone ELSE who is trying to fraudulently cancel their membership. This is called "checks and balances" and the person making these false claims seems totally ignorant of the simpliest of sound business practices. Any member can cancel my mailing or faxing a cancellation letter with their name, address, phone, member ID, and any personal data that will confirm their identity. Also this information can be EMAILED as well, and when a member CALLS Ameriplan to cancel, they are told ALL these various ways they can cancel.

YOUR SITE CLAIMS: It has been reported that this cancellation process does not work. Customers call back to AmeriPlan and are told to fill out the form online and that nothing else can be done, leaving the customer in a catch 22 situation.

FACT: This is totally false. There is no "form online" to cancel, and there never has been. The person making this false claim is mentally confused. Furthermore, 1 business day after mailing, faxing, or emailing cancellation information a member can call Ameriplan toll-free and verify they are cancelled and will not be charged again.

YOUR SITE CLAIMS: AmeriPlan claims these cases are isolated and that they, "have never had any of these complaints." However, any internet search on The AmeriPlan Scam will yield an alarming number of consumer complaints.

FACT: Here's a clue that the person making these false claims is not telling the truth ... they do not give their name or their contact information. Never ever believe anonymous hate mail. This anonymous person has an agenda, and their agenda is obviously not to help people with the truth, because their false claims are easily exposed for the lies and distortions that they are. Furtherfore, anyone tempted to believe anything this anonymous accuser says, can contact the Dallas Better Business Bureau -- who by the way, recently congratulated Ameriplan for having the best (yes the #1) best track record of ALL the companies that are approved by the BBB.

Ameriplan is the PREMIER and the BEST discounted health care plan in the country with over 1.5 million people happily covered. Ameriplan has been operating now for 14 years and doing business in every state (except Alaska). Very powerful.


Michael Lancto
1-206-666-3939
Ameriplan National Vice President

[SHELLY]

Shelly, I'm surprised. I thought you had your hand on the pulse of the matter. After reviewing the sites you reference, it appears you are just regurgitating other false information. Come on, show some originality. You did not even have the common courtesy to post the letter from Ameriplan refuting the false claims in the site you referenced.

You want some originality? OK, I'll bite, answer me this:

(1) I see that for only $59.95 per month I can get the Plus™* package that includes auto club, legal services and identity theft assistance. How much is your commission on each of these packages you sell?

(2) Did you just start your IBO in February since they are offering a $25 special? Or have you been with the company for a while.

(3) Is this helping the people who need medical care? Check out the video: http://www.homebaseddream.com/index2.html


It appears to me that you are a frustrated former MLM loser.

Hold that thought, Walt.


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[gypsy639]

Do I see signs of legitimate researck going on here? If so, I'll give legitimate responses.


My earnings on all member services are 30% level for the life of the membership, which by the way exceeds 80% of all who enroll.
I have been an Ameriplan IBO for 6 months, and proud to say I'm responsible for providing health and dental care for over 100 families who previously could not afford such protection.
The single website you offered is one of 100's maybe 1000's that promote the "biz op". Nothing wrong here. But, there are an equal number, like mine, that promote the benefits only. Of the nearly 70,000 IBO's across the country, more IBO's promote benefits than "biz op". For the last 100 years Network Marketing has proven to be the most efficient method to effectively and efficient method to market a product or service.Shelly, it's far too easy to be a critic from afar. I'd like to know what your solution is for providing any type of affordable medical or dental care for the 48 million people in the U S who can't afford what the health insurance industry is asking.

[30A Skunkape]

Do I see signs of legitimate researck going on here? If so, I'll give legitimate responses.


My earnings on all member services are 30% level for the life of the membership, which by the way exceeds 80% of all who enroll.
I have been an Ameriplan IBO for 6 months, and proud to say I'm responsible for providing health and dental care for over 100 families who previously could not afford such protection.
The single website you offered is one of 100's maybe 1000's that promote the "biz op". Nothing wrong here. But, there are an equal number, like mine, that promote the benefits only. Of the nearly 70,000 IBO's across the country, more IBO's promote benefits than "biz op". For the last 100 years Network Marketing has proven to be the most efficient method to effectively and efficient method to market a product or service.Shelly, it's far too easy to be a critic from afar. I'd like to know what your solution is for providing any type of affordable medical or dental care for the 48 million people in the U S who can't afford what the health insurance industry is asking.

Maybe I can help Shelly and suggest everyone buy a bunch of Amway vitamins and take them every day?:wave:

[SHELLY]

Shelly, it's far too easy to be a critic from afar. I'd like to know what your solution is for providing any type of affordable medical or dental care for the 48 million people in the U S who can't afford what the health insurance industry is asking.[/LEFT]

How about Procard International? http://www.procardinternational.com/


They have dental for $9.95 AND they've got PizzaDelivery.com as a partner company! AND as of a few minutes ago, they're an accredited business with the BBB. :cool:

Or how about passing up the middlemen and contacting one of the doctors or dentists listed on the website and ask them to give you a discount for cash service (maybe even ask to split the $20 monthly fee--$10 for his/her trouble).

Seriously, I understand that the health system in the USA is screwed up, but the MLM companies are more about making money through recruiting people who provide them money, not only through sales of <in this case> health care cards (which deliver no guarantees of availability of medical services), but are making the lion's share of their income by selling IBO kits, websites, dvds, training materials and advertising material; and the monthly dues of their "brokers." At the core, these MLMs are all the same...they only differ in the type of "legitimate" product they are pushing.

The nuts and bolts of MLMs caught my attention while I was in college and saw a fun-loving, newly married couple I knew turn into Amway pod-people almost overnight....it was one of the reasons I chose to write a research paper on MLMs.

[gypsy639]

I see you are still beating the MLM drum. How much is enough? Just provide the world with a serious alternative to the health care system as we know it.

I hope you find a real project to occupy your time. I for one have too full a plate to continue this p....... contest about MLM. My focus is working with people who can't afford health insurance or can;t get it because they are uninsurable.

Good luck with your efforts.

[sowalgayboi]

gypsy, you are really barking up the wrong tree here. We have all already been thru this with someone else locally. You need money and standing behind the register at TomThumb wasn't glamorous. We understand that, but seriously go sell this product at church, a social club, or door to door.

P.S. I'll take SHELLY's opinion over yours any day.

[SHELLY]

I hope you find a real project to occupy your time. I for one have too full a plate to continue this p....... contest about MLM.

Good luck with your efforts.

One thing I know about MLMs is that they become more prevalent during economic downturns--as evidenced by recent posts from MLMs on this message board and throughout the Internet.

That being the case, my current project is to alert people to give pause...stop...think...and do some research before tossing their hard-earned money at these MLMs.

I do hope that your customers have found some value in the product you have sold them.

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[Mango]

That being the case, my current project is to alert people to give pause...stop...think...and do some research before tossing their hard-earned money at these MLMs.
.

and all this time I thought your current project was trying trying to figure out how to get the non nibbled chocolate from the bottom layer of the box. :biggrin:
My bad. Carry on. :doh:

[sowalgayboi]

and all this time I thought your current project was trying trying to figure out how to get the non nibbled chocolate from the bottom layer of the box. :biggrin:
My bad. Carry on. :doh:

He or She is multi tasking. ;-)

[Margarita]

Shelly - I just wanted to let you know how much I appreciate your informative posts on this board.

[SHELLY]

Shelly - I just wanted to let you know how much I appreciate your informative posts on this board.

Now you went and got me all vaklempt!

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[2bohemians]

http://www.sowal.com/bb/gallery/files/1/2/0/3/truth.gif

[kurt]

More MLM stuff merged here. I would think the internet would make it harder to get people to fall for this garbage. I guess people involved are:
A) Too dumb to Google
B) Preying on A)
C) All of the above

[kathydwells]

More MLM stuff merged here. I would think the internet would make it harder to get people to fall for this garbage. I guess people involved are:
A) Too dumb to Google
B) Preying on A)
C) All of the above

:clap:

[30A Skunkape]

Hey, I resemble that statement.

Whatever happened to Josh. He use to post on here from time to time but since the MLM he seems to have disappeared.

There was a sighting in Watercolor yesterday:cool:

[John R]

Wow, this thread got a new life. Sorry I missed the second act while I was gone. Hilarious.

[momof2kids]

Shelly - I just wanted to let you know how much I appreciate your informative posts on this board.


I second this! I :wub: reading Shelly! :clap:

[rheffron]

Most people get their medical advice from their Doctor or from TV ads from Drug companies touting the latest miracle drug. A number of these drugs get recalled and taken off the market even after the FDA has approved them.

Now there is a way to find out for yourself what is safe and good for your body and mind!

A New LOCAL Company has launched a newsletter that is doing unbiased research using independent sources and studies not paid for by drug companies or others wanting you to buy their products.

By subscribing to the newsletter for only $12 a month you not only get this objective and unbiased information, but you also get an opportunity to earn commissions if you wish by encouraging others to get involved. There are no products to buy and no pressure selling. Even if you just subscribe to the Newsletter, the $12 is well worth the price which is about what it costs for a one martini at most places on 30A or Destin.

You can subsribe and/or get involved by going to:

advancedhealthandfitness.com/gabi and check it out for yourself and feel free to call me at 622-0722 or 251-408-7283 with any questions.

Thanks!

Ray

[kurt]

Should this be merged with the MLM thread?

[sowalgayboi]

Should this be merged with the MLM thread?

Looks like it to me, the website has a section for opportunities, and reeks of MLM.

[30A Skunkape]

I didn't know where else to post this, but since local MLM efforts seem targeted at struggling fool's gold prospectors, I figured this was as good a place as any.

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/4b243902-fd06-11dc-961e-000077b07658.html?nclick_check=1

[John R]

could you paste the article please?

[sowalgayboi]

High prices spark fresh gold rush in California
By Matthew Garrahan in Los Angeles

Published: March 28 2008 20:38 | Last updated: March 28 2008 20:38

It has been almost 160 years since the first California gold rush but, with prices hitting record highs, prospectors are once again flocking to the state’s rivers and deserts in search of the precious metal.

Gold’s ascent – prices crossed the $1,000 an ounce barrier this month and remain well above $900 – has sent sales of mining equipment soaring.

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I'm not registering for the rest, I get enough spam.

[sowalgayboi]

High prices spark fresh gold rush in California
By Matthew Garrahan in Los Angeles

Published: March 28 2008 20:38 | Last updated: March 28 2008 20:38

It has been almost 160 years since the first California gold rush but, with prices hitting record highs, prospectors are once again flocking to the state’s rivers and deserts in search of the precious metal.

Gold’s ascent – prices crossed the $1,000 an ounce barrier this month and remain well above $900 – has sent sales of mining equipment soaring.

--------------------------------------------------------
I'm not registering for the rest, I get enough spam.

[SHELLY]

High prices spark fresh gold rush in California
By Matthew Garrahan in Los Angeles

It has been almost 160 years since the first California gold rush but, with prices hitting record highs, prospectors are once again flocking to the state’s rivers and deserts in search of the precious metal.

Gold’s ascent – prices crossed the $1,000 an ounce barrier this month and remain well above $900 – has sent sales of mining equipment soaring.

“There’s been a dramatic change . . . our sales have risen four-fold in the last three months,” said Harrigan McGregor, owner of GoldFeverProspecting.com, an equipment retailer in northern California.

“This is the second big California gold rush. We’ve had a lot of phone calls from people who are quitting their jobs and prospecting full-time.” :cool:

The growth of prospecting by individuals has been accompanied by a sharp increase in commercial mining activity. Commercial claims, most of which involve gold mining, rocketed to 2,274 in the first quarter of this year, up from 132 in the same period of 2005, the Bureau of Land Management says.

Roger Haskins, senior specialist for mining law at the BLM, said the high price of gold was “obviously driving [mining] activity up tremendously”.

“We have a market imbalance at the moment and there’s more demand than supply,” he added. “Gold sits in a little niche because it’s speculative . . . People buy it as a hedge for the future.”

Membership in the Gold Prospectors Association of America “has tripled in a very short space of time”, said Corey Rudolph, an official of the southern California-based group, which organises events for recreational miners.

The hotspot is a 320km strip known as the Gold Belt, or “Motherlode”, which runs near Highway 49 (named for prospecting “49ers” of the 19th century) and the Sierra Nevada mountains. Mr Rudolph said 5-10 per cent of available gold had been mined. “There’s still a lot of gold out there for the smart guys.”

The market in second-hand gold is also booming, with southern California pawnshops reporting increased trade as people sell unwanted gold items. Depending on the quality, these items can be refined and resold.

However, Mr McGregor said raw gold can fetch even higher prices. “If you find a nugget larger than your pinkie finger, it could sell for up to 30 per cent more than the spot price.”
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http://www.ci.escondido.ca.us/library/imagesH/91_1583.jpg

Now is a great time to buy.....picks and shovels.



.

.

[wrobert]

Xocai & the Healthy-Chocolate-Living-PRO System is a home-based business for people who care. I think the most important question that I get asked is, ‘what do I need to do – in order to be successful.’ Well, the answer is really simple – Align yourself with a Revolutionary World Class Product and a Team of successful people.


Anyone ever tried this chocolate? Curious as to the taste. I heard it on the radio, suppose to be able to eat it three times a day and get all your servings of fruits and vegetables.

It is a MLM product. $300 to get involved seems a bit over the top to me, I was just curious about the chocolate itself.

[Smiling JOe]

if it was better than other chocolate, it would be sold in grocery stores, rather than door to door.

[rheffron]

There is a meeting today for anyone interested in more information. There is no charge. This is our main kickoff event of the year and we expect as many as 500 people. [
Any questions please call me at 622-0722 or 865-0582

Thanks!

[scooterbug44]

This pinged the meter!

There are "no products to buy", yet I can "choose to only subscribe to the newsletter" and "earn commissions"? :roll:

Only $12 a month to get independent research and advice from folks who have no credentials and who are quick w/ the legalese to tell me I must verify their findings with the same folks they slam in their sales pitch - think I'll get that martini instead! ;-)

[rheffron]

This pinged the meter!

There are "no products to buy", yet I can "choose to only subscribe to the newsletter" and "earn commissions"? :roll:

Only $12 a month to get independent research and advice from folks who have no credentials and who are quick w/ the legalese to tell me I must verify their findings with the same folks they slam in their sales pitch - think I'll get that martini instead! ;-)



Will you be needing directions?

[Rita]

Hey, I've got a photoblocker to sell! It isn't particularly healthy but will save you money from potential red-light-camera tickets and allow you to speed through those intersections on red. Could you ask for anything more? You don't even go to a meeting - just order and chunk down your hard-earned $$!

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e129/gulfwindsway/trolls/photoblockerscam-1.jpg

[elgordoboy]

Will you be needing directions?
Yeah, do I go left or right to get to the venue when I get into Suckerville?

[SHELLY]

Geez :roll: these MLMs are becoming like roaches in this area/economy....I blame Greenspan and Bush.

WRobert--here's you chance to taste this "chocolate vegetable," just get prepared to be beaten into submission to become a business owner.

Economically speaking, we'll know we've reached the "bottom" when these things (MLMs) start to disappear...from the looks of things, we've got a loooooonnnnnngggg way to go.


.

[SHELLY]

Yeha do I go left or right to get to the venue when I get into Suckerville?

:biggrin:

.

[elgordoboy]

My 2nd red chiclet! It says "The poster is disparaging without personal knowledge of the opportunity insuring that other interested parties will shy away" I disagree that I am "ensuring" that other interested parties will stay away. If you believe in your product you will need to defend it occasionally.

[Rita]

You got a red chiclet for that??? Someone is awfully free with their bloody chiclets! :blink:


.

[SHELLY]

My 2nd red chiclet! It says "The poster is disparaging without personal knowledge of the opportunity insuring that other interested parties will shy away"

Consider it a badge of honor.


.

[SHELLY]

Here's a couple films about the "opportunity" so you can save yourself time and gas attending the presentation:

http://thechocolatecdsystem.com/program3/player.html

http://www.thechocolatecdsystem.com/program4/player.html


:roll: No need to thank me now.


.

[Smiling JOe]

There is a meeting today for anyone interested in more information. There is no charge. This is our main kickoff event of the year and we expect as many as 500 people. [
Any questions please call me at 622-0722 or 865-0582

Thanks!Take some pics for us. :wave:

[Smiling JOe]

Economically speaking, we'll know we've reached the "bottom" when these things (MLMs) start to disappear...from the looks of things, we've got a loooooonnnnnngggg way to go.


.How do you figure that? Seems to me the bottom is when everyone is pimping MLMs, not when they start to disappear. :idontno:

[Smiling JOe]

Wow, Gordo. I didn't get my second one for dissin' MLM. Where's my second red chicklet?

[elgordoboy]

Wow, Gordo. I didn't get my second one for dissin' MLM. Where's my second red chicklet?
Scared to mess with you probably :lol:

[30A Skunkape]

I guess the MLM proponents are too busy sharpening their pick axes to give us an earnings update;-)

[SHELLY]

How do you figure that? Seems to me the bottom is when everyone is pimping MLMs, not when they start to disappear. :idontno:

These MLMs tend to pop-up as the economy goes into decline (once people realize that the economy is not going to be "all better" in a couple of weeks) and they multiply as we fall further into the abyss. The pyramids take some time to form as they work themselves back and forth across the country and as they cycle through new "companies and products."

As unemployment numbers rise and inflation takes hold, more and more people are drawn to these "get rich owning your own company" schemes. Eventually, after wasting much time and much money, "company owners" come to the realization that there is no market for their "products" and recruiting opportunities have dried up (not only because the product is too expensive and/or useless, but also the customers and downlines are struggling with the economic downturn themselves).

IMO, the economy hasn't bottomed yet; I expect to see more and more of these MLMs pop up over the coming months. They're well aware that there are droves of folks, who became accustomed to making mucho < & easy> dinero during the RE bubble, just ripe for the picking.

Once the economy corrects and employment picks up, the crumpling MLM pyramids will crash and the top folks at the MLM headquarters will slither back under their rocks to count their money.


.
.

[sowalgayboi]

My 2nd red chiclet! It says "The poster is disparaging without personal knowledge of the opportunity insuring that other interested parties will shy away" I disagree that I am "ensuring" that other interested parties will stay away. If you believe in your product you will need to defend it occasionally.

I offset it slightly with a green chiclet.

[rheffron]

My 2nd red chiclet! It says "The poster is disparaging without personal knowledge of the opportunity insuring that other interested parties will shy away" I disagree that I am "ensuring" that other interested parties will stay away. If you believe in your product you will need to defend it occasionally.

Just to keep the fun going:


ThesaurusLegend: Synonyms Related Words Antonyms
Verb1.insure - be careful or certain to do something; make certain of something; "He verified that the valves were closed"; "See that the curtains are closed"; "control the quality of the product"see to it (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/see+to+it), ensure (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/ensure), ascertain (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/ascertain), check (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/check), assure (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/assure), control (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/control), see (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/see)
proofread (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/proofread), proof (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/proof) - read for errors; "I should proofread my manuscripts"
check off (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/check+off), tick off (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/tick+off), mark off (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/mark+off), tick (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/tick), check (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/check), mark (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/mark) - put a check mark on or near or next to; "Please check each name on the list"; "tick off the items"; "mark off the units"
control (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/control) - verify by using a duplicate register for comparison; "control an account"
check (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/check) - verify by consulting a source or authority; "check the spelling of this word"; "check your facts"
double-check (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/double-check) - check once more to be absolutely sure
cross-check (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/cross-check) - check out conflicting sources; crosscheck facts, for example
cinch (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/cinch) - make sure of
card (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/card) - ask someone for identification to determine whether he or she is old enough to consume liquor; "I was carded when I tried to buy a beer!"
spot-check (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/spot-check) - pick out random samples for examination in order to ensure high quality
verify (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/verify) - confirm the truth of; "Please verify that the doors are closed"; "verify a claim"
ascertain (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/ascertain), find out (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/find+out), learn (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/learn), watch (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/watch), determine (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/determine), see (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/see), check (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/check) - find out, learn, or determine with certainty, usually by making an inquiry or other effort; "I want to see whether she speaks French"; "See whether it works"; "find out if he speaks Russian"; "Check whether the train leaves on time"
cover (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/cover) - maintain a check on; especially by patrolling; "The second officer covered the top floor"
verify (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/verify), control (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/control) - check or regulate (a scientific experiment) by conducting a parallel experiment or comparing with another standard; "Are you controlling for the temperature?"

2.insure - make certain of; "This nest egg will ensure a nice retirement for us"; "Preparation will guarantee success!"assure (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/assure), ensure (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/ensure), guarantee (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/guarantee), secure (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/secure)
guarantee (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/guarantee), vouch (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/vouch) - give surety or assume responsibility; "I vouch for the quality of my products"
doom (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/doom) - make certain of the failure or destruction of; "This decision will doom me to lose my position"
make (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/make) - assure the success of; "A good review by this critic will make your play!"

3.http://img.tfd.com/wn/50/BF95B-insure.jpginsure - protect by insurance; "The insurance won't cover this"underwrite (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/underwrite), cover (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/cover)
reinsure (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/reinsure) - insure again by assuming all or a part of the liability of an insurance company already covering a risk
warrant (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/warrant), guarantee (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/guarantee) - stand behind and guarantee the quality, accuracy, or condition of; "The dealer warrants all the cars he sells"; "I warrant this information"
indemnify (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/indemnify) - secure against future loss, damage, or liability; give security for; "This plan indemnifies workers against wages lost through illness"
cover (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/cover) - to take an action to protect against future problems; "Count the cash in the drawer twice just to cover yourself"
overcompensate (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/overcompensate), compensate (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/compensate), cover (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/cover) - make up for shortcomings or a feeling of inferiority by exaggerating good qualities; "he is compensating for being a bad father"

4.insure - take out insurance forreinsure (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/reinsure) - insure again by transferring to another insurance company all or a part of a liability assumed
protect (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/protect) - shield from danger, injury, destruction, or damage; "Weatherbeater protects your roof from the rain"
reinsure (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/reinsure) - provide additional insurance for
coinsure (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/coinsure) - take out coinsurance


Link to this page:

[elgordoboy]

A thesaurus is not a dictionary, if it were why would they have both? But it was a fun read :wave:

[Miss Kitty]

A thesaurus is not a dictionary, if it were why would they have both? But it was a fun read :wave:

I guess you will be easy to spot at the soiree...you'll be the one drinking, Ensure. :wave:

[rheffron]

A thesaurus is not a dictionary, if it were why would they have both? But it was a fun read :wave:

At the very least it's a Cimmonom!

[Miss Kitty]

At the very least it's a Cimmonom!

Is that a roll or a part of speech? :idontno:

[seagrovegirl]

Just to keep the fun going:


ThesaurusLegend: Synonyms Related Words Antonyms
Verb1.insure - be careful or certain to do something; make certain of something; "He verified that the valves were closed"; "See that the curtains are closed"; "control the quality of the product"see to it (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/see+to+it), ensure (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/ensure), ascertain (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/ascertain), check (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/check), assure (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/assure), control (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/control), see (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/see)
proofread (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/proofread), proof (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/proof) - read for errors; "I should proofread my manuscripts"
check off (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/check+off), tick off (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/tick+off), mark off (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/mark+off), tick (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/tick), check (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/check), mark (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/mark) - put a check mark on or near or next to; "Please check each name on the list"; "tick off the items"; "mark off the units"
control (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/control) - verify by using a duplicate register for comparison; "control an account"
check (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/check) - verify by consulting a source or authority; "check the spelling of this word"; "check your facts"
double-check (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/double-check) - check once more to be absolutely sure
cross-check (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/cross-check) - check out conflicting sources; crosscheck facts, for example
cinch (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/cinch) - make sure of
card (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/card) - ask someone for identification to determine whether he or she is old enough to consume liquor; "I was carded when I tried to buy a beer!"
spot-check (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/spot-check) - pick out random samples for examination in order to ensure high quality
verify (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/verify) - confirm the truth of; "Please verify that the doors are closed"; "verify a claim"
ascertain (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/ascertain), find out (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/find+out), learn (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/learn), watch (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/watch), determine (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/determine), see (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/see), check (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/check) - find out, learn, or determine with certainty, usually by making an inquiry or other effort; "I want to see whether she speaks French"; "See whether it works"; "find out if he speaks Russian"; "Check whether the train leaves on time"
cover (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/cover) - maintain a check on; especially by patrolling; "The second officer covered the top floor"
verify (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/verify), control (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/control) - check or regulate (a scientific experiment) by conducting a parallel experiment or comparing with another standard; "Are you controlling for the temperature?"

2.insure - make certain of; "This nest egg will ensure a nice retirement for us"; "Preparation will guarantee success!"assure (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/assure), ensure (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/ensure), guarantee (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/guarantee), secure (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/secure)
guarantee (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/guarantee), vouch (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/vouch) - give surety or assume responsibility; "I vouch for the quality of my products"
doom (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/doom) - make certain of the failure or destruction of; "This decision will doom me to lose my position"
make (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/make) - assure the success of; "A good review by this critic will make your play!"

3.http://img.tfd.com/wn/50/BF95B-insure.jpginsure - protect by insurance; "The insurance won't cover this"underwrite (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/underwrite), cover (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/cover)
reinsure (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/reinsure) - insure again by assuming all or a part of the liability of an insurance company already covering a risk
warrant (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/warrant), guarantee (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/guarantee) - stand behind and guarantee the quality, accuracy, or condition of; "The dealer warrants all the cars he sells"; "I warrant this information"
indemnify (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/indemnify) - secure against future loss, damage, or liability; give security for; "This plan indemnifies workers against wages lost through illness"
cover (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/cover) - to take an action to protect against future problems; "Count the cash in the drawer twice just to cover yourself"
overcompensate (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/overcompensate), compensate (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/compensate), cover (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/cover) - make up for shortcomings or a feeling of inferiority by exaggerating good qualities; "he is compensating for being a bad father"

4.insure - take out insurance forreinsure (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/reinsure) - insure again by transferring to another insurance company all or a part of a liability assumed
protect (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/protect) - shield from danger, injury, destruction, or damage; "Weatherbeater protects your roof from the rain"
reinsure (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/reinsure) - provide additional insurance for
coinsure (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/coinsure) - take out coinsurance


Link to this page:

Is this supposed to be impressive????:idontno:

[SHELLY]

Is this supposed to be impressive????:idontno:

....only to people who think there's a demand for "chocolate vegetables" at over $100 a box.


.

[elgordoboy]

....only to people who think there's a demand for "chocolate vegetables" at over $100 a box.


.
*choke* *gasp* I had no idea. I haven't followed any of the links, wishing to maintain my "lack of personal knowledge".

[rheffron]

I am not the chocolate guy! Let's stay on subject!

[SHELLY]

I am not the chocolate guy! Let's stay on subject!

:blink: Then to which meeting was this post (written by you) alluding if not the Willy Wonka MLM??

http://www.sowal.com/bb/showpost.php?p=390002&postcount=98

There is a meeting today for anyone interested in more information. There is no charge. This is our main kickoff event of the year and we expect as many as 500 people. [
Any questions please call me at 622-0722 or 865-0582

Thanks!

[rheffron]

:blink: Then to which meeting was this post (written by you) alluding if not the Willy Wonka MLM??

http://www.sowal.com/bb/showpost.php?p=390002&postcount=98

Advancedhealthandfitness.com/gabi

Thanks!

[SHELLY]

Advancedhealthandfitness.com/gabi

Thanks!

Geez :roll: another one. I'm going to need a scorecard to keep up with these things--they're multiplying like rats.

Admittedly this MLM is the most insane I've encountered. This guy writes a newletter about health and fitness and "sells" subscriptions for $12 per month through an MLM???

Seriously, you need to get out now while you still have your bank account and friendships/relationships intact.

If you need money, get a job at one of the various businesses that advertise on this message board--you'll be better off.


.

[Rita]

:blink: Then to which meeting was this post (written by you) alluding if not the Willy Wonka MLM??


:clap: classic!


.

[wrobert]

:blink: Then to which meeting was this post (written by you) alluding if not the Willy Wonka MLM??

http://www.sowal.com/bb/showpost.php?p=390002&postcount=98

I have no interest in a MLM for income purposes. I am trying to find out if the chocolate tastes good.

Your films were interesting. I hate to see people get involved in this stuff but every once in a while you see something being sold this way that appears to be a pretty good product.

[sowalgayboi]

Is that a roll or a part of speech? :idontno:

You don't have one in the mall in Dallas? :funn:

[SHELLY]

I have no interest in a MLM for income purposes. I am trying to find out if the chocolate tastes good.

Your films were interesting. I hate to see people get involved in this stuff but every once in a while you see something being sold this way that appears to be a pretty good product.

Here's a excerpt from a guy who did a "taste test" on his blog:

At a recent shopping expedition in Los Angeles, I got to taste Xocai (pronounced "sho-sigh") chocolate, which is being marketed more as a health food product than a sweet indulgence. Chocolate is becoming more closely associated with health because of its antioxidant components, and the addition of acai to the chocolate adds the health benefits of the acai berry, now considered to be a super fruit. According to the website, Xocai will give you increased energy, help you sleep better, decrease joint pain, reduce sugar cravings lower blood pressure and cholesterol, reduce allergies and arthritis, and improve diabetic readings.

Good good on all the health stuff, but I was interested in the taste. Each small domed brick piece of chocolate comes wrapped in gold foil, which really makes it look like candy. I love dark chocolate, and the Xocai nuggets have a very high cocoa percentage. However, I have to say that it definitely tasted medicinal, and somewhat powdery. I also didn't feel the antioxidant power of "10 pounds of spinach" that each nugget supposedly has.

Oh well. I think I'd rather eat spinach for antioxidants, and a Teuscher truffle for chocolate.
-------------------------------------------------------

(:cool: Sounds about right to me.)

[John R]

mlm's are funny.

[sowalgayboi]

I'm still waiting for the review of the "taste testing" done locally.

:popcorn:

[SHELLY]

I'm still waiting for the review of the "taste testing" done locally.

:popcorn:

Those with the money to buy this over-priced crap have enough sense not to waste their money...and those with no sense, who think it's a good idea, don't have the money to buy it.


.

[rapunzel]

And if you're looking for multi-tasking chocolate --

http://www.cocoavino.com/images/figsedit01.jpg

Go here, and you can find chocolate/fig/port deliciousness -- and it's eco-friendly.

http://www.cocoavino.com/shop/drunkenfigs.php

[scooterbug44]

I think that even if it didn't change the flavor, knowing my chocolate was full of vegetables would make me like it less! ;-)

[Smiling JOe]

mlm's are funny.MLMs are like miniature Sam's Clubs, but they focus more on selling memberships than products. Imagine a big box store like Sam's Club, being filled with three or four products, but hundred's of employees getting paid to sign people up to join. Once you pay the fee, you get to join the other employees in selling memberships to join the club. ("Oh, yeah, BTW, there is some chocolate in the back of the building, which you can buy, and the store will even give you a token commission if you can sell some, but the real money is up front, here, signing up new members. Isn't this great?")

[rocket136]

OOOH I got into this way too late... lotta juice here!

Check out these resources, I think they are the beat on the net.
www.mlm-thetruth.com (http://www.mlm-thetruth.com) and www.pyramidschemealert.org (http://www.pyramidschemealert.org)

Some great info here I especially like the comparison Dr. Jon Tayor makes with the payoff comparison of an investment in mlm and an investment in the worst of the casio games; roulette, you'll do better at roulette.

There is a lot of good solid analytics on these sites and ratings for mlms by the numbers. There are plenty of reports and pdf's to download. He's been involved in trials where mlms have been charged with criminal offences.

[Smiling JOe]

Like one needs to read a website to understand the value , or should I say costs, of MLMs. lol

[beachFool]

It can be summed up in three words:

Run from MLM

[chrisv]

MLMs are like miniature Sam's Clubs, but they focus more on selling memberships than products. Imagine a big box store like Sam's Club, being filled with three or four products, but hundred's of employees getting paid to sign people up to join. Once you pay the fee, you get to join the other employees in selling memberships to join the club. ("Oh, yeah, BTW, there is some chocolate in the back of the building, which you can buy, and the store will even give you a token commission if you can sell some, but the real money is up front, here, signing up new members. Isn't this great?")

I went to Sam's Club today. Great price on spare ribs:D. If you smell the smoke tomorrow, paddle over.

[Smiling JOe]

I'll keep a nose up in the air.

[sowalgayboi]

Beware Joe, they might just try and sell you a Sam's membership. :biggrin:

[chrisv]

Beware Joe, they might just try and sell you a Sam's membership. :biggrin:

Damn, busted:funn:

[Smiling JOe]

Beware Joe, they might just try and sell you a Sam's membership. :biggrin:
Damn!:bang: I've been punked twice in one night. I should have known.

[rocket136]

Like one needs to read a website to understand the value , or should I say costs, of MLMs. lol

Sure ... why are there so many people sucked into them? They have a slick mesage with little emphasis on the FACTS; because the facts do not support the system. FACT: 98% of people who make the investment in MLM lose money. They won't tell you that in their pitch.