Grayton Interest

[Donna]

I am curious to hear thoughts as to why no homes in Grayton Beach seem to be moving right now. I know the market is slow in general (overpriced inventory, too much inventory, slow national trend in second homes, investors lurking in hopes of a "bottom-out," etc.). But I have also heard from some "in the know" that the market for the higher-priced properties has moved down to Rosemary and Alys Beaches, where developments cater more to buyers in the way of luxuries, amenities, etc. Took our home off the market and happy enough to keep it for however long. But my thought in buying at Grayton (besides loving the community and that beach since early childhood) was that it was no nice and the character so unique and protected that many buyers would want Grayton if they could afford it.

I'm just wondering about the thoughts of others on this subject, out of curiosity. Thanks for opining!

:idontno:

[kurt]

Marketing is heavy in the new urban villes. The target market is more interested in fine dining and day spas than rusty trucks and sandy floors.

"Have you been to Grayton Beach"?
"Oh yes we went to the red Bar and saw some cute cottages but other than that there's nothing to do."

[carmen]

Does that rationale seep over into rentals also? Are rentals as vigorous in
Grayton as the upscale communities? Are rental prices lower as a reflection of rusty trucks, etc?

[kurt]

Does that rationale seep over into rentals also? Are rentals as vigorous in
Grayton as the upscale communities? Are rental prices lower as a reflection of rusty trucks, etc?

Sorry I can't check numbers for you but in general I would say that a rental house in the middle of Grayton Beach is going to be less expensive to rent than a similar property in Rosemary Beach or Seaside, even if age and condition are the same. There is a hefty HOA fee in the new urban towns, and values and taxes are also higher.

I believe the rentals in Grayton Beach book well, especially in the Summer.

[fisher]

I am curious to hear thoughts as to why no homes in Grayton Beach seem to be moving right now. I know the market is slow in general (overpriced inventory, too much inventory, slow national trend in second homes, investors lurking in hopes of a "bottom-out," etc.). But I have also heard from some "in the know" that the market for the higher-priced properties has moved down to Rosemary and Alys Beaches, where developments cater more to buyers in the way of luxuries, amenities, etc. Took our home off the market and happy enough to keep it for however long. But my thought in buying at Grayton (besides loving the community and that beach since early childhood) was that it was no nice and the character so unique and protected that many buyers would want Grayton if they could afford it.

I'm just wondering about the thoughts of others on this subject, out of curiosity. Thanks for opining!

:idontno:

It is slow everywhere. Just look at the Real Trend numbers for the last 2 years. Basically, we have been on a continuous downward trend line in terms of sales versus prior year. Even with the recent improvement in sales, unit volume is still down versus prior year.

The best selling area along 30A for the last few years has been and continues to be Watercolor. However, many of the sales in Watercolor have been at lower and lower prices per square foot--a home closed in phase II the other day for $380 per square foot and many recent sales have been well below $500 per square foot (prices reminiscent of 2003 and 2002). Rosemary has been slow and Alys has been absolutely dead since the initial offerings a couple of years ago. Watersound is doing a little better than Rosemary. Other major developments like the Preserve and Cypress Dunes aren't moving any inventory.

[Donna]

All very interesting feedback. I can tell you that the rentals of our house at Grayton (Conch Out) are higher than ever. Plus, the house books almost solid for the entire season from one spring/summer to the next. So Grayton seems in demand as a family vacation rental venue. I had to laugh at Kurt's very astute comment about there being nothing to do at Grayton (which I actually like). When I was a kid, there was absolutely nothing to do at Grayton. The Red Bar was a general store with a jukebox and there were no restaurants at all. Also, no grocery market other than "The Store." Goes without saying, there was no shopping whatsoever. And...what's a Starbucks?

My sense is that prices at Grayton are now a minimum of $1M and up, many of them in the $2M to $4-5M range, and that folks in that market are more the Rosemary and Alys Beaches herd. May be temporary; maybe not. I can understand some of the pain of Blue Mountain and Dune Allen, as those beaches are very shallow and any erosion whatsoever has dire consequences. Also, "nothing to do" in that direction, even though it is closer to Destin.

Well, I am happy to be keeping my house for the foreseeable future. But always interested in where market trends are or are headed. Perhaps someone with rental property in some of the planned community developments could weigh in as to whether the large inventory of new rentals has eroded their demand from past years?

[Smiling JOe]

I hear that most of WaterColor's in house rentals are almost booked solid for this season. This is fourth hand info, so I'm not certain of its accuracy. Maybe someone from WC will reply.

[Miss Kitty]

I hear that most of WaterColor's in house rentals are almost booked solid for this season. This is fourth hand info, so I'm not certain of its accuracy. Maybe someone from WC will reply.

I hear that at the bar. :wave: Ours is rented all summer. :clap:

[rancid]

My sense is that prices at Grayton are now a minimum of $1M and up, many of them in the $2M to $4-5M range, and that folks in that market are more the Rosemary and Alys Beaches herd.


I saw a house in old Grayton listed around $900K. Anyone know much about this house?

[goodwitch58]

If it's the one on Garfield it was just reduced...it is a grayt old Florida beach house, has lots of possibilities. Huge lot. Nice trees. Needs some updating, but has a certain charm, IMO.

[Donna]

Is this $900K house called "Crab Shack," by any chance?

I am not surprised that WaterColor is filled for the summer. The Beach Club alone is worth the price of admission. Nice amenities and a nice beach.

[goodwitch58]

Donna, it has been reduced to $895K, and it belongs to the Mayo family. Not sure of it's name. It is the yellow block house on the left of Garfield if you are driving North.

[30A Skunkape]

Could the slow movement of houses in Grayton be related to the fact that there are many older properties there and more expensive to insure?:idontno:

[goodwitch58]

Probably insurance could be a consideration...things are slow everywhere, and the idea of insurance and property taxes factor into the situation, at least in prospective buyers minds.

It takes a certain kind of person to appreciate the Grayton community and lately we seem to have the kind of buyers who are looking for the more upscale neighborhoods, rather than the Old Florida Beach Community.

I actually have a person who wants to buy this house; but he needs to sell some other things first and vacant lots in up and coming developments are moving even slower than older houses right now!:idontno:

[egrp]

kurt hit on this, but everything is a give and take. The HOA fees that come with WC, Rosemary, Alys, and WSB are pretty hefty, so you pay for those amentities. IMHO this cuts both ways with buyers. SOme prefer Greyton cause no fees...so prefered master planned for the amenities.

[rancid]

Could the slow movement of houses in Grayton be related to the fact that there are many older properties there and more expensive to insure?:idontno:


any ideas on insurance costs for a $900 house? Property taxes?

[Busta Hustle]

Grayton still has a soul. There are huge inventories everywhere and few buyers. There is more inventory on the way. Enjoy Grayton for what it is, as i'm sure we all do...

[TN2FLA]

Current Insurance and Tax info for 78 Garfield St :

Property Tax - $4,206
Home Insurance - $2,544
Flood Insurance - $264

[TN2FLA]

Link to 78 Garfield...

http://ecarmls.com/EmeraldReports/listings.asp?ID=8010032658

[SHELLY]

Current Insurance and Tax info for 78 Garfield St :

Property Tax - $4,206
Home Insurance - $2,544
Flood Insurance - $264

The $2544 home insurance (fire and wind I suspect) is DEAD CHEAP for a $900K home.

That certainly shouldn't be holding anyone back who's looking in that price range.



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[Smiling JOe]

If it sells for $900K, expect property taxes to be in the neighborhood of $6,990 per year, for residential property in SoWal, based on current millage rates (which will most likely increase this year).

$900,000 x .85 = 765,000 (likely assessed value)
765,000 x .009 (current millage rate rounded up) = $6885 taxes

[rancid]

Link to 78 Garfield...

http://ecarmls.com/EmeraldReports/listings.asp?ID=8010032658

Does anyone have some thoughts or advice on this price? $450 sq/ft seems a little high for an old house in need of some repair and updating. I have seen threads discussing Watercolor homes in the $500 sq/ft range which are brand new with the latest and graytest in amenities.

Personally, I feel Grayton as a certain charm that appeals to me but does anyone think this justifies pricing in line with a newer development with more amenities (pool ,clubhouse etc..)?

I am mainly looking for something for my own long term use but would still like the best long term investment.

[SHELLY]

Does anyone have some thoughts or advice on this price? $450 sq/ft seems a little high for an old house in need of some repair and updating. I have seen threads discussing Watercolor homes in the $500 sq/ft range which are brand new with the latest and graytest in amenities.

Personally, I feel Grayton as a certain charm that appeals to me but does anyone think this justifies pricing in line with a newer development with more amenities (pool ,clubhouse etc..)?

I am mainly looking for something for my own long term use but would still like the best long term investment.

Personally, in the end (long term of course), I think that non-HOA places will eventually end up outpacing the area market. You would have a better opportunity to re-zone down the road while, in the meantime, avoid the escalating fees and "rules & regs" of the association.

The property @ 73 Garfield certiainly needs to be stripped of the Brady-Bunch-era paneling and requires much more work to give it a more breezy, beachy feel (including central a/c). Since it appears to be empty, and if you're interested, I'd present the owner with your lowball "back of the business card price/time limit ®" and walk away. In this market, 'nothing ventured, nothing gained.'

.

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[TN2FLA]

I am sorry to dissapoint you Shelly, there is no granite in 78 Garfield...the Brady Brunch ate their ramen from paper plates

[SHELLY]

...the Brady Brunch ate their ramen from paper plates

So are some of the folks who bought over-priced McMansions in recent years...only they don't have "Alice" to toss the plates in the trash.


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[Donna]

I am no indicator of comparables, because when I wanted to buy a beach house, only wanted Grayton and wanted at least a good view. Now so glad that Gulf front was not a "wanna," because I wouldn't want to replace my walkovers with every tropical storm. However, one of the big considerations when weighing Seaside was the HOA fees, which were quite large and guaranteed to increase over time. I felt that most of the amenities at Seaside were enjoyed by anyone within driving distance, yet we don't have to pay a monthly fee for it.

When considering a purchase of these houses, one needs to think about the maintenance and management fees, even without an HOA. In addition to insurance and taxes, you have management and handyman charges, commissions if you rent, housekeeping, storm prep, pool maintenance and repair (if you have one), landscaping (even in beach sand), and other incidentals. The salt air really works a house over in a short time.

BUT IT'S WORTH IT!

[Bob]

Donna, If you had to choose again, wouldn't you end up in the same place? Grayton is the heart and soul of 30A.

[Paula]

Some places have very low homeowner fees. If that's a concern, you can find such places. The fewer extras a place has and the less fancy landscaping that needs to be tended (the natural flora and fauna are quite nice), the lower the home owner fees. So, if you just want a place to live and a pool, you don't need to pay high homeowners fees. For someone who lives far away from their place, I find it nice to have a homeowner association (which also means that many people in the community are looking out for each other and the community) to keep an eye on things.

[Donna]

Good point, Paula. And your cottages have great amenities, also close to the beaches. The Bainbridge Island place has a HOA because there are nine acres of landscaped area and a walkable waterfront, pavilion with outdoor kitchen, boat storage facilities, its own water company and septic system for the 18 places. It's awfully nice to know that other homeowners are looking out for everything. In fact, my nextdoor neighbor just e-mailed to say they are having their skylights cleaned and the guy offered to discount both of us 20% if he did mine, too. Easy as pie.

Our rental company also does many management functions (at a price) and on the whole, I'm not unhappy with those services. The time when one is really on the rack is when a storm is possibly moving in. To board or not to board? And you hate to fly down there and possibly get trapped somewhere due to weather conditions. But I have decided that this is what frequent flyer miles are for. Of course, I am hoping for a normal storm season instead of a repeat of the unheard of 2005 year.

[Paula]

And if there are storms this year, Donna, then at least we'll probably get a chance to see each other and other SoWallers as we check on our places.

Homeowners' fees aren't for everyone, but they are good for whoever feels they are getting services that are important to them. They've been worth it to me for peace of mind and also for building a community in SoWal with people who have relatively similar goals/interests for their properties/lives in SoWal. When something goes wrong or well in the "neighborhood" it's good to know we'll all hear about it quickly and have a say in what happens next.

[Indigo Jill]

The $2544 home insurance (fire and wind I suspect) is DEAD CHEAP for a $900K home.

That certainly shouldn't be holding anyone back who's looking in that price range.



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No doubt! We live north of 98 in Point Washington - our home is only about 1,600 sqft. and not in a flood zone, and we pay $1950+/year. Our neighbors across the street are with State Farm (but just got notice of cancellation) and they told me yesterday their insurance jumped from $2300 to over $4000!

[jdarg]

Current Insurance and Tax info for 78 Garfield St :

Property Tax - $4,206
Home Insurance - $2,544
Flood Insurance - $264

Our wind insurance is totally separate from our homeowners. Does this home insurance figure include the wind? Our wind insurance alone is $2500. Something does not compute here.

[Donna]

We have a number of different forms of insurance:
Liability (fire, etc.)
Umbrella from primary residence that covers the second home
Wind (always a separate policy)
Flood (FEMA)
Lost rental revenue policy

Ours runs $4,617 per year on a three-story house in the coastal area, in a flood zone.

So I never understand people saying their insurance was ramped up to double digits. There doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason to the game.
:idontno:

[nowgirl]

Our wind insurance is totally separate from our homeowners. Does this home insurance figure include the wind? Our wind insurance alone is $2500. Something does not compute here.

There are still a few companies that have "all inclusive" policies. The wind deductible is just higher. I pay $1,800 a year for one of these type policies on a cottage in the Seacrest area....a pretty good deal by most standards.
I was required to put the 3M protective film on the windows in order to qualify for the policy. That cost was about another $1,800, but it was worth it to avoid the separate wind with Citizen's at $2,500.

I'll check with the Grayton owner and find out if her policy includes wind.

[Smiling JOe]

Donna, that is surprising very inexpensive sounding for your house. Are you sure that you didn't move the decimal over one place? I would have thought insurance for your home would be at least double that. Who is your insurer?

[SHELLY]

Donna, that is surprising very inexpensive sounding for your house. Are you sure that you didn't move the decimal over one place? I would have thought insurance for your home would be at least double that. Who is your insurer?


And deductible...


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